Exploring the Impact of the California Wildfires on Education: A Conversation with Dr. Breeda McGrath

Jeffrey Bradbury (00:01.656)

My guest today has been in education for over 20 years. She has a PhD in school psychology and she frequently contributes to the APA's civil discourse project that promotes respectful dialogue across diverse perspectives. Want to bring on today, Dr. Brita McGrath. Brita, how are you today? Welcome to the program.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (00:20.266)

Thanks so much, Jeffrey. I'm doing well. I'm excited for the conversation. We were put off in terms of our schedule because of the wildfires in Southern California and all kinds of scheduling issues, but I'm glad we were able to get together.

Jeffrey Bradbury (00:33.004)

I am so excited to talk to you today, especially this time of year. We're ending a school year we're thinking ahead. A lot of people right now are starting to think about the you know, what does the next school year look like? Talk to us a little bit about how you're doing this year. How's your school year been?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (00:49.974)

It's been wild for a number of reasons. I started at Pacific Oaks College and Children's School this year, starting in July. I had been with the Community Solution Education System for the last 17, 18 years anyway. I was very familiar with Pacific Oaks College, but this year I started out as the president of both the college and the children's school. So it's been a very exciting journey. It's been really interesting living in Pasadena, getting to know the Pasadena community.

and really getting to understand what the mission and vision and values and reality of life at Pacific Oaks is and the integration. This is typical for education colleges and schools, the integration between the identity of an education college and the community itself. And that's just been terrific. As you said, I've been an educator for a long time. And so really getting into the weeds of that and trying to support it and also getting to know people and what it means to be.

in this college and what we're trying to do for the community. It's been great. Then we had the wildfires in January that really had a strong impact on how our spring went. And so we did a number of different things that kind of solidified our relationship to the community, help people realize what Pacific Oaks is and wants to be and has always been. And so we've just been grateful to have opportunities to support families, to support the school districts, to support folks in this area.

And it's hard to believe it's May. It's really hard to believe that we're already at this kind of period of time in the school year. And we're planning for the summer and planning for next year and learning the lessons we've learned and also trying to really focus on what families need to do and the burning questions that they're dealing with right now across the country around what's the future of education going to look like for the next couple of years.

Jeffrey Bradbury (02:45.464)

Well, I want to back you up for a second. I know this isn't our primary topic. But since you brought it up, how are things in Southern California? What was that process like of seeing your neighborhood or your area where you are up in flames? And what's been happening to the area? Since that it seems like the news has moved forward. But obviously the community is still there picking up the pieces. What is life like right now in Southern California?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (03:15.84)

Well, it's quite the mixture, Jeff. It's a mixture of both devastating loss, right? The trauma from devastating loss that everyone across the community has experienced in one way or another. It will take a long time, especially for Altadena, to rebuild and recover in so many different ways. The other side of it is that the outpouring of support

the experience of really coming together, rising together, seeing resilience grow, seeing the love, the outpouring of love and just self-denial and sacrifice and desire to help one another. That's been almost overwhelming. So it's still very raw. A lot of work has been done. A lot of different agencies, organizations, community sectors have come together to really support in every way that they can and try and figure it out.

The coordination has been a massive complex challenge, being able to stay abreast of everything that's going on and quantify what the needs are so that you can figure out whoever you are or whatever your organization is, what we can do, how to best serve, how to best use our resources and what we have available to meet the needs. That's been quite the challenge, but it's been amazing to see how people have stepped up, how they're also staying focused.

on the long haul, right? That long seven to 10 year trajectory that we believe the recovery will take. This week in particular has been very eventful. So on Tuesday, I was at the Pasadena Educational Foundation fundraising event. Today, this morning, I was at Mayor Gordo's Interfaith Breakfast. We have our own board meeting here on Friday. And today, in fact, the Pasadena Community Foundation announced that

Our proposal for support for early childhood providers was accepted. And so I'm working together with a number of community leaders in early childhood education to provide stipends for providers. they, Pasadena Community Foundation awarded us $1.3 million. That money is coming from folks in this community and around the country who really want to get into this immediate recovery phase. And so.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (05:35.24)

It's just been amazing to see what's happening, but the devastation, as you said, is just huge. You know, to go up into Altadena, to know how many people in Pasadena were affected and to see those neighborhoods is just incredibly, it's just very hard to wrap your head around what you're looking at and trying to figure out how that rebuilding will happen. But the strength of the area is really something that you can feel and everyone is participating. So it's really something else.

Jeffrey Bradbury (06:05.294)

Can you talk to us a little bit about what education, if any, looks like? Are there makeshift schools? did they just cancel the rest of the school year? Obviously buildings are no longer there. Obviously on the outside are looking in on this situation, but did they just cancel the school year for all of South Carolina? I what, I don't even have the question for what I'm thinking about all that.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (06:21.963)

Yeah.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (06:29.759)

Right. Right. That's the wash. Yeah. Sure.

Jeffrey Bradbury (06:33.464)

help me put those words together because the pictures are just heartbreaking. And you seem to, you know, well, it's over, we move forward. But if there's nowhere to go, is there learning happening? I don't even know the questions right now, which is one of those things. So could you give us a scope of what does what does a student do during the day? I don't even know the questions. I'm sorry. It's one of those things, right? Help me out with this one.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (06:39.082)

We are there.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (06:47.926)

Great question.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (07:01.142)

Well, you you're grappling with the questions and you're kind of representing what a lot of people are thinking about trying to wrap their heads around. And so your first question is very student focused and that's exactly what people were trying to do. Let's figure out what to do. And you're only going to get my, you know, limited perspective on what I have seen and what I've been involved with. What has happened is that

On January 7th, the wind storms were devastating in and of themselves. They had a really strong impact. And then the fires started the next day. Many schools were shut down because of the wind and also because of how rapidly the fires were taking hold and burning across neighborhoods. Five elementary schools in the Pasadena Unified Public School District, which covers a great deal of this area that was affected by the Eaton Canyon fire.

Five schools were destroyed. And what really to, I suppose, give a summary of what I have seen, what really happened for students and for families is that the school districts tried to provide immediate response options so that they could use, for example, the lessons we learned from COVID to most educational institutions.

If they could, went to remote emergency remote learning or emergency remote teaching. And then since then, they've tried to figure out how do we house students in alternative sites. And so through the whole spectrum of ages, that's what they tried to do because, you know, a burned down school is not going to be recovered in a couple of months. That just takes a lot of planning. And also it's a time when a school district tries to decide

Okay, so what are we doing with these buildings? Do we have enough capacity to be able to rebuild that school? Should we reorganize given, should we change? mean, school districts make decisions about buildings and about facilities based on a number of factors, budget, resources, population, need, all kinds of things. And so they have been deciding what to do and they're still in the midst of that. But what they did is they found temporary sites. And that's from both the early childhood age.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (09:19.094)

through the whole spectrum. So many different organizations were coming up to say, we have space, we have temporary space we can offer. The city of Pasadena and Altadena Chamber of Commerce, all of those groups were coming together to figure out how to remove the barriers to getting back to normal as soon as possible. It was very challenging. It was very frustrating. was difficult for people to not have.

schools or classes right away as soon as they could. That affects people who are trying to get to work. It affects people trying to figure out how to ensure that there's no loss of learning, no loss of growth. And so there were challenges, but schools definitely didn't just shut down for the remainder of the year. January 8, they had just come back to school. They were just back after the holidays. so the reality was that they went to emergency response.

responded to potential buildings, potential spaces as soon as they could. The city tried to then remove the barriers, licensing, regulations, all of that really prioritized and especially in Los Angeles County, you know, largely speaking, the authorities tried to make it possible to focus on children's needs and family needs as soon as possible and not let bureaucracy get in the way.

It doesn't always work perfectly, but I have to say that most people are reporting that they felt response as soon as possible. There were lots of logistics that also made it difficult, like FEMA, like insurance, like just trying to make sure that all of those structures that we have in place could respond as soon as possible, could assess the damage. And in the meantime, people were trying to figure out where they could live. You know, there's a housing crisis in the Los Angeles County area.

among other areas in the country, especially these larger urban areas. And so for families trying to figure out how do I make sure my children get back even to the school that they've been going to if it's still up and running and not shut down, if I don't have a job or if we don't have a home, what do we do? So it was a very and still is a very complex set of circumstances. And so people tried to stay in touch and provide solutions together. One of the groups that really

Dr. Breeda McGrath (11:40.53)

I think made a huge difference or I could see was really trying to tackle the complexity of the issue was the Partnership for Children, Youth and Families. They could see right away that it was a huge complex problem to solve. And so they went from having a monthly meeting, standing meeting that brings organizations together to solve problems and to come up with solutions for children, youth and families. And they went to a standing weekly meeting.

So every Wednesday morning we have a meeting. The public health department started having standing meetings. All of the different groups were having standing meetings where they would bring in cross-disciplinary teams to make sure that everyone knew what the needs are, where the resources are, what problems and obstacles were being found. That was tremendous. While I can't say it was an easy process, those meetings are still happening and are continuing.

across the community and we are still having and trying to solve lots of problems from everything from education to housing to employment to food insecurity. But I must say, you know, people were being creative and being very open about what the problems were and trying not to get offended if it was their zone or their domain. People were saying, this is not working. We need better solutions for this or we're in this sector of the community is not being heard.

And so just that tremendous desire to be involved and listen and answer and show up is just incredible. And so that, as I said, that's ongoing. Those Wednesday morning meetings are still happening. And it was amazing. I've only been here since July. It was amazing on Tuesday night to go to the Pasadena Educational Foundation and meet all of these people that I've only met on Zoom in person.

because everyone is now showing up in these spaces and we've been working together in ways that we just couldn't have imagined before because this is truly still a crisis.

Jeffrey Bradbury (13:42.776)

Well, I know we didn't plan on having this conversation and I don't know if you're prepared to answer my next question, but for anybody out there listening that's interested in supporting, what advice would you have if somebody is interested in lending a hand financially, physically, however?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (13:51.114)

Yes.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (13:57.948)

I so appreciate you asking that question, Jeffrey. Two of the largest support groups within the area are the Pasadena Community Foundation and the California Community Foundation. And what's happening is that with those two groups, they are getting a big picture of all of the different kinds of efforts that are going on. And they're not only funding directly, but they're also bringing in other foundations to then support in multiple different ways.

So those are two very direct ways that people can go and see what their money, what their efforts, what their support and resources are going to help. In the early childhood community in particular, Baby to Baby has been an incredible resource for us. We had a distribution center on the grounds of the Pacific Oaks College. And Baby to Baby, Options for Learning, Child Care Alliance of Los Angeles.

those groups really got together and made sure that we were supplied with things like diapers and air purifiers and supplies for families that they could come and get immediately, baby formula, things like that. So those larger groups really made a difference and it helped people to really be able to say, you know, here's what we need, here's when we need it and here's the magnitude of what we need. And having a local group like Pasadena Community Foundation,

made all the difference because they were able to get the money out very fast. The Fire Aid LA concerts made a huge difference as well. They were able to disperse funds immediately. The first phase of funding for a lot of these large groups has happened and they're getting ready for second phases of that. Red Cross was in here. All of those larger groups make such a difference because they're able to get in immediately. They're able to

put into action local networks that are already connected, that already have this kind of chain of actions that they put into place when emergencies happen. But those two, the Pasadena Community Foundation and California Community Foundation, are two that we were really proposing to folks that they directly give to or reach out to to see what efforts are they engaged in and where would you prefer to support.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (16:18.518)

they'll be able to show you where your money can go and your efforts can go.

Jeffrey Bradbury (16:24.792)

We're speaking today with Dr. Breida McGrath, who's the president of the Pacific Oaks College and Children's School. Dr. McGrath, I want to talk a little bit today about early childhood education, specifically when it gets married to technology. And, you know, being an educator of early learners, being a father of 11 year olds, I've watched kids grow up in a technology driven house.

I've watched students become digital natives and I'm helping them through that, especially as they started to their preteen years here. Talk to us a little bit about your work in this field. And if I could start off with any question, what is the state of education right now when it comes to digital learning skills in students of that age group?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (17:14.454)

It's a really interesting field. It's changing rapidly. And it's also one that a lot of people are worried about, I will say. Because as we see children early in their development, we see two-year-olds and they know how to swipe. We don't have to teach them that and how long it took many of us. I'm thinking myself about how late in my life I was really embracing technology in my everyday life. It is fascinating to see how

quickly young children are taking to it. We have both a college that trains early childhood educators and trains special education teachers, elementary education teachers and teachers in general. we have a doctoral program in early childhood education. And we're really seeing rapid changes in some areas of early childhood. And then we're also seeing some traditional theories and practices.

that are being sustained all the way through. So the marriage of the old and the new is really interesting to watch right now. What I'm seeing in early childhood around the incorporation of digital technology is that the benefits are being seen around how to enhance the child's experience, not necessarily using technology as the learning method, but actually getting a child into the typical skills that we expect them to learn.

Technology can be used to help interaction, but it's the actual interaction and playing with others and speaking to others and problem solving that's the key. So technology can make it faster, can make it smoother, can increase the options that are available, can make it more accessible for children to reach, connect with, engage with more people through various means.

but the learning experiences themselves, the developmental of stages or milestones or whatever way you want to think about them, they still, those traditional things that we're looking for in language learning, in pro-social behaviors, in interest in learning, the curiosity, the exploration, reading.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (19:29.332)

that's still somewhat traditional, right? So some of the old milestones that we have seen in the past and relied on as sort of stages or developmental benchmarks, those are still pretty much the same. We're not seeing a lot that's different there, but the way in which we present information, the way in which we help children socialize together, the way in which we help them problem solve, the way in which we help them be curious and explore their environments is enhanced by using

digital technology and the access to resources is one of the most exciting aspects of technology because it really makes a broader range of experiences accessible to a child no matter where they are, no matter what kind of financial or socioeconomic environment they have. Digital technology makes so many things more available. In some ways that can actually stimulate kids more and enhance their cognitive development and really help

them expand their learning, learn faster, learn more. And so that's been really kind of a leveler across society if you've got that available for lots of different kids. It also helps to support diverse learners. Technology can really enhance the ways in which we present information. And so it helps to bridge the gap between, we'll say, a traditional learning material or resource.

and a child who really needs to learn it in a different way. Technology helps us present information in a multitude of ways. And it also helps us figure out how to do that faster. It can present you with multiple different options for presenting a lesson or for accessing ways of presenting a concept. So technology is really that kind of a leveler if you just think about it even the simplest ways.

Jeffrey Bradbury (21:24.522)

I think for many when it comes to students of an early age and they think of technology immediately the only thing that would pop into their mind is screen time give the kid an iPad and walk away but that's just not the case is it

Dr. Breeda McGrath (21:36.404)

Yes.

Yeah.

No, it's not. And there are a couple of reasons for that. The life that we're trying to prepare a child for is not passive observation. You know, a successful adult is someone who has a variety of different kinds of skills. Yes, part of it is self-management and learning, observing. But a lot of your success as a human being is in being able to relate to other people, to socialize, to problem solve.

to use your environment, to explore your environment, to have that healthy interactive engagement with everything that you come across. And so sitting and passively learning doesn't prepare you for any of that. It doesn't prepare you for much problem solving except those examples that you're watching. Screen time also is something that parents and teachers are finding that they kind of need to limit because it doesn't really help children learn the skill fully.

Right. It's a much more passive way of learning. And some parents are finding that screen time really doesn't help children self-regulate. And they often find that sometimes kids are a bit more temperamental or less patient if they've been just sitting and watching and passively engaged in the screen for longer than is healthy. It also doesn't help with physical development. You know, we rely on physical interaction, activity outside to bring us part of that.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (23:09.18)

know, fine and gross motor development. And sitting watching is not going to help with that. know, having a young child lead a sedentary lifestyle is really not helpful. Their way of interpreting things is not something that you can figure out unless you're engaging with them. You don't really know what they're learning from the screen unless you're asking questions, unless you're practicing those skills, unless you're really understanding their interpretation. And so

it's really important for children to have more of that interaction, both with individuals and with their environments. It's a more experiential way of exploring. As I think about the children's school that we have, we have children from ages two to five, and we're known for our emergent curriculum. And sometimes people assume that we don't have any technology in the classroom or we don't have any technology at the school. And that would be very

I think unrealistic for us, given the children at home are engaging with technology. We use it in a variety of different ways, but we're so known for this play-based exploratory type of approach to early childhood education. And we've been doing it for 80 years. So it's something that's definitely appreciated and expanded upon, and it's been sustained throughout life. And so I think being able to balance both pieces, use technology,

where it's really helpful, but focusing on where you want the child to go in life. How do you see them as a successful six-year-old? It's not just about mastering content. It's also about those social skills.

Jeffrey Bradbury (24:47.854)

You know, teaching a six year old to master content is one thing. One of the things that's happening in the country right now is this conversation of to what degree should artificial intelligence be brought into younger grade levels. There's a lot of things that are happening in school districts. There's a lot of things that's coming out of Washington. And I'd love to get your take on this as we go through this process because there is a movement out there.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (24:51.838)

Yes.

Jeffrey Bradbury (25:17.184)

to ensure that students as young as Bill in the blank are able to be able to be and I hate to say this about six year olds prompt engineers. How do you see this movement happening? If given the mandate to do so, in what ways should we be bringing in these emerging technologies into students who don't know how to read or write?

have no clue and literally a screen is just a toy. How do you support your staff in bringing in these emerging technologies to not only support their students but also to teach their students?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (26:01.77)

That's an interesting question. I'm not sure that all groups are really bringing in AI into the early childhood education space just yet in terms of interaction, direct interaction with the children. What I will say is an emerging area for education across all ages is the possibility of having tutoring using AI. And I obviously I'm only giving you my experience. I'm sure there are others who are far more advanced in

in integrating artificial intelligence into education than I am. I have a very optimistic perspective on it, but my optimistic perspective comes with guardrails, I would say. I think there's great potential for that individualized attention that artificial intelligence can bring. It can help us with staffing shortages if we're going to use it in terms of tutoring. I think it needs to be very well designed.

I think it needs to be monitored and I think it needs to be tested in lots of different ways. But that's something where learning from a child's exploration and responding to a child's exploration is where AI can really help us. Making sure that it's an extension of the teacher as opposed to something independent, something unguided, something that's only random.

exploration by the child is not something that you really are able to then manage or measure, you know, and I think there are lots of ways to to manage it. And I can say that tutoring, you know, adaptive learning and adaptive teaching could be very fun. It can really support exploration as long as we know what we're doing and we're watching it, you know, and being open to the creativity.

while at the same time keeping our eyes on the prize of where do we want the child to go and how do we know they're getting there.

Jeffrey Bradbury (28:02.892)

think it's defining what the AI term is, right. And even in my school district, we're having these conversations. I think all school districts are having these conversations. I don't personally think a six year old should be playing with chat GPT, co pilot Gemini, etc. But if there was an application that said, write something and what you know, we can define the term write something and make the computer draw a square a circle a draw a you know,

Dr. Breeda McGrath (28:09.759)

Yeah.

Jeffrey Bradbury (28:30.818)

describe what the house is that you'd like it to build, and then it builds it. That's in my world, AI training, right? You're, you're not you're not you're not building large language models, you're basically saying I need a blue house with a steeple and a this and a that and there it goes. I think there's an opportunity for that. And I think there's a wonderful opportunity for that. Obviously, the idea of students, I'm sure where you are in Southern California,

Dr. Breeda McGrath (28:39.732)

Yes. Yes.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (28:48.459)

Yes.

Jeffrey Bradbury (29:00.226)

don't all speak English using an AI model that's going to help incorporate all student learners into the learning experience. I think there's a lot of potential there. I'm just afraid that when people say AI, they think that GPT but that doesn't have to be the case.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (29:08.992)

Yep.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (29:17.608)

Right. Exactly. And I think there's room also for having student interaction on the product, whether it is the drawing, whether it is asking your AI to explain something in a way that I can understand, setting it up so that the child is then asked, do you understand or how do you understand what I just explained or drew?

or what I've produced for you so that the child is saying, here's what I think this is, or asking the child, now put that in your own terms. As long as there's a subsequent evaluation of how the child interacts with AI, then you've got something. Otherwise, it's a prompt, and AI is doing all the work.

And you're unable to measure whether or not the child is meeting those benchmarks, those developmental benchmarks that you're really hoping for. So leaving a child independently to produce something that you can track on the computer they haven't produced in fact themselves, is a pretty straightforward answer there. So the assessment models that we use in education are going to need a massive upgrade. And that's an interesting challenge, I think, for the folks who are developing AI. I think that's a...

a good challenge to put in place. How do we measure this up against what we expect development to be per learning outcomes, per developmental phases, know, for what we've thought that the state standards should be, you know, what curriculum has been aiming for, what curriculum, how do we want to then adjust the curriculum? And when we see outliers and when we see behavior that we can't explain, we have to track it down.

You know, we have to be able to, for example, you to your point about screen time, so many things are observable and measurable. If we're seeing behavior in children and we're able to track down, you know, what the associations are, when this behavior is happening, what's the relationship to screen time? What are the different things that we've been introducing into classes that are showing a positive or a negative change in behavior, or at least are correlated with negative and positive changes in behavior? Get those school psychologists in there.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (31:36.606)

and ask and ask the teachers, what did you see that's different? It's all observable, measurable. The good thing again about AI is that it's traceable. You can see what the history is, but we have to be responsible then for what we're offering and not just presume that we're handing a teaching opportunity to something that's going to then have the same goals that we do.

Jeffrey Bradbury (32:01.902)

So here we are at the end of the school year. And obviously a lot of people are looking forward to September. What advice are you giving your staff, whether it be your administrative staff, whether it be your teaching staff, as far as learning about these technologies? Could you give us even briefly, what does a professional development roadmap look for your community right now? So that way when these things come to play become.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (32:15.221)

Yeah.

Jeffrey Bradbury (32:29.292)

I don't want to say cheaper, but more affordable for the classroom. More accessible. What advice are you providing to your staff as far as making sure that they're ready for when the future becomes the reality and the present?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (32:31.146)

Yeah, yeah, more accessible. Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (32:45.692)

It's a real scaffolded approach that I have to say from the college administrators, faculty, know, adjuncts, staff, children's school, teachers, staff, everyone across the board. It's a real scaffolded approach, respecting where people are at in this new technology, you know, emerging. It's an emerging thing for us, helping people to feel curious.

is the important piece. And maybe that's my bias, that's our approach, right? In emerging curriculum, curiosity is king, right? We start with curiosity. So helping folks feel like their curiosity is healthy, helping them see what their next step is, whatever that might be. For some folks, it's go ahead and play with it. For some of our teachers at the children's school who are also doctoral students at the college, it's

getting into the weeds of that and saying, OK, for some of them, I'm asking them, how are you going to use it? And some of them have said to me, I'm not. Isn't that cheating? Isn't that plagiarism? So giving them suggestions around how they can use it and incorporate their assignments into it and say, look, you can have ChatGPT do this, or you can have AI in general do this for you, but you're always declaring what you've done. You're being transparent about how you've used it.

Think about how it can stretch you further, right? Even the deep research feature. For a lot of the teachers and a lot of the faculty, it's helping them expand their own professional development skills, expand their knowledge. To your point, accessibility. Give me that in the summer. Give me the most high impact practices.

in AI for early childhood, they can learn faster, they can get the information faster, they can learn it in ways that really approach their learning styles and then helping our staff reduce the amount of time they're taking in certain tasks, right? Some procedural tasks, I think it can increase our efficiency and then helping some of our senior administrators who have an appetite for this, helping them coach others and make it more accessible.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (35:00.788)

So really doing that kind of differentiated learning model, differentiated learning approach with the emphasis on curiosity and also helping people see this has arrived. We cannot afford to be behind the curve, but it is something you have to get your fingers into. You have to figure out where you're at with it, reach out when you're uncertain and let's come together and learn together around it. If there are workshops you want to learn, you know, from.

Let us know. If there's something you want to share with others, let's again share our curiosity, excitement about learning. It's brand new. How often is it we can say that, wow, this is really a new thing? Education is often seen as a very traditional, old-fashioned kind of a field. Not anymore. This is really new. It's uncharted territory. And we have to learn this together. We cannot afford to avoid it.

and it can help us and we have to really focus on it. In the summertime, you know, it's often that time that's looked on as there might be a couple of hours here, there might be an opportunity to try things out and to support yourself as well as then preparing yourself for the fall.

Jeffrey Bradbury (36:18.062)

There's so much that I want to ask you. And I think the first question I want to ask you is let's do this on a part two, because there are so many different things on this topic that my mind is spinning. But I want to ask you one last topic here before I let you go, which is, you know, so many school districts out there are trying to put this puzzle together. How do we bring these emerging technologies in as teachers, as a staff, as a support mechanism?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (36:38.133)

Yeah.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (36:43.156)

Yes.

Jeffrey Bradbury (36:48.076)

Let's just start with central office. And then let's figure it out. And there's, course, some school districts that are, let's go do this and let's go partner with with ed tech companies. Look into the camera, talk to those district leaders out there, talk to those instructional coaches that might be listening to this. What advice do you guys have as far as putting together a program, putting together a

Dr. Breeda McGrath (37:14.87)

Yeah.

Jeffrey Bradbury (37:17.506)

definition of right now as an example, my district, I'm part of our AI program. And we're having that what is how do we define what is appropriate, what is inappropriate? And do we do next year as a teacher pilot? And the following year is the student pilot? Is that too late? Should we be doing all of this all at the same time? If we start

Dr. Breeda McGrath (37:28.405)

Yes.

Jeffrey Bradbury (37:46.718)

students three years from now on AI. That's now six years behind other school districts. So final question. What do we do?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (37:59.934)

Well, you're only getting my opinion. I do have my answer is really rooted in my experiences of working in different kinds of schools broadly, school defined broadly. I do believe that a thoughtful approach is essential. You know, in education, what lasts is what is well planned. I'm a real teacher there.

Jeffrey Bradbury (38:04.088)

Trying to get you there.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (38:28.658)

If you have a good plan that is really rooted in what your true goals are, what your strategic plan is, what your budget can afford and is sustainable, and what your stakeholders will buy into, you have the potential for success in the long term. I think as long as you're doing something, you're not going to be left behind. If you avoid it and say we either can't afford it or you

survive on assumptions, you will be left behind and the families and children will either leave or will be very disappointed and let you know all about that. One thing that we did at the college system is decide big picture as a system. How do we do this? We were asking ourselves the same question. How do we do this? And we looked at it from that bigger picture. Systemically,

What should we do? What is our mandate in terms of what we promise students? What do we offer students? What's our contract with the community? Given that, how can that be interpreted through this challenge, this opportunity? So we decided that we need to be more efficient and we need to incorporate AI into all of the different aspects of life at the colleges all the way through. And the children's school becomes part of that definition. So we decided.

what it means from a bigger picture, which needs are highest priority for us. And that's what a school needs to always be driven by. What are the highest needs? How can technology serve those highest needs and solve those problems? Once you are still on mission, on vision, and using technology to serve that,

then your long-term impact is still strong. Then you can stay within budget. Then you can get everyone behind it. Bringing all your stakeholders in, bringing those parents in like you're doing at your district. Asking people who will help, who have oftentimes more knowledge in this area of technology than the folks at the district. People will contribute ideas. Will say, here's how I think we can and should be doing it. Here's what I've researched elsewhere.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (40:51.808)

Here's what we're doing in my organization. Here's what I know from what my children are exploring. So staying true to the mission and being open to understanding what technology can do to help you get to that mission. Doing it with honesty, doing it with integrity, and bringing others in to say, here's how you can do it. Sometimes that means getting consultants in. Sometimes it means talking to the big companies to say, all right, we'll take a 40-minute consult.

We'd like to hear what you're doing with districts who can afford way more than we can, right? If you're a charter school, if you're a small private, looking out there to see what your community members, what your neighbors are doing. Yes, they're competitors. In education, we call them neighbors and we call them our community partners. Asking what they're doing and coming together to say, let's see this opportunity, let's use it and let's move forward. Creating opportunities for creative members.

Is there a teacher that you think can be an early adopter and can help their peers? Doing what you can and helping people understand why they should get on board with it, why it's going to help their jobs, why it's going to help them be more effective and how it's really going to deliver on the promise to children and families is what it has to boil down to. I know it's very big picture.

But if you ask people those questions, they will answer you and tell you, well, I think we should do it this way. I think we need more, you know, iPads in the classrooms. OK, for this year, can we afford it? Well, maybe not. OK, what can we do that would bring us to that same outcome? Can we go to the library and borrow the computers there? You know, what is it that we can do to get us to that?

Jeffrey Bradbury (42:35.82)

Well, this has certainly been an amazing and eye opening conversation on both topics. And if anybody out there is looking to learn more about this kind of work and the work that Dr. McGrath is doing, where can they get a hold of you and learn more about the great things that are happening out in Southern California?

Dr. Breeda McGrath (42:53.142)

I am at Pacific Oaks College and Children's School. Look that up and you'll find me. I'm the president of the college and the school. They're both under the same organization. We have a fabulous campus in Pasadena, just north of the freeway. I think people call it in California here. And the children's school is just on California, two miles south of the college.

The children's school has been there for 80 years. So if you ask anyone in Pasadena, where's the Pacific Oaks Children's School, they'll point you to California and Arroyo. And I think online, we have a website for both. We have lovely little videos on both. We have a YouTube channel for the Pacific Oaks College that will show you what the spirit, the philosophy, the mission and vision of the college is. And then the children's school, there are just some gorgeous videos and some lovely information about both.

As you can tell, I'm pretty passionate about the community that we've built here and we've been here a while. So a lot of people know who and where we are. And we are part of the Community Solution System of Education. one of six colleges around the country that's really serving students, serving a variety of different community needs. And we're pretty easy to find.

Jeffrey Bradbury (44:13.102)

Well, Dr. McGrath, thank you so much for joining us today. And if anybody out there has any questions about not only how to support the great things that are happening out in Southern California to support the families and the schools and the small businesses, please feel free to reach out. I'm going to make sure that in the transcript, we have all of the links to everything that Dr. McGrath mentioned. And if you'd like to learn more about her school, we're also going to leave links to everything over there on our show notes. This is again, digital learning today podcast episode number 68. So Dr. McGrath

Thank you so much for coming on the show.

Dr. Breeda McGrath (44:44.384)

Thanks so much, Chef. It was a really lovely conversation. I really appreciate the questions.

Jeffrey Bradbury (44:49.036)

And that wraps up this episode of Digital Learning today. If this is the first time you're checking out the show, don't forget to hit that like and subscribe button. Of course, we drop a new episode every single Monday. And don't forget to head on over to teachercast.net. Check out our newsletter. And if you'd like to be on our show, please leave a message over on our contact form. Would love to have you guys be a part of the TeacherCast Educational Network family. And that wraps up this episode on behalf of Dr. McGrath and everybody here on TeacherCast. My name is Jeff Bradbury, reminding you guys to keep up the great work in your classrooms and continue sharing your passions with your students.