Oct. 13, 2025
Episode 46: Listen First, Lead with Heart: Principal Shannon Seale’s Journey from Classroom to School Leader
Send us a text What if the strongest leadership move is to listen first, decide second, and never micromanage? That’s the tought line of our conversation with Principal Shannon Seale, who went from high school social studies to leading a pre-K–2 campus, without losing her sense of humor, her humility, or her focus on what matters most. We explore the origin of Shannon’s calling to teach, how watching weak leadership shaped her convictions, and why avoiding conflict silently breaks cultures. ...
What if the strongest leadership move is to listen first, decide second, and never micromanage? That’s the tought line of our conversation with Principal Shannon Seale, who went from high school social studies to leading a pre-K–2 campus, without losing her sense of humor, her humility, or her focus on what matters most.
We explore the origin of Shannon’s calling to teach, how watching weak leadership shaped her convictions, and why avoiding conflict silently breaks cultures. She shares the two lenses that guide every decision, safety and instruction, and the practical systems that keep her promises real: time-blocked walkthroughs, alarms, and a calendar that catches everything from meetings to lunch detentions. We dig into the jump from high school to elementary, the new ways she learned to speak with first-time school parents, and how she balances autonomy with support so teachers feel trusted and students get consistent, high-quality instruction.
Shannon also opens up about building a leadership team that tells her when an idea is bad, treating school like a team sport where every role matters, and using TikTok and Instagram to learn from educators nationwide while humanizing the principalship. We talk narrative control, positive storytelling, and the simple truth that if you don’t tell your school’s story, someone else will. Finally, she looks ahead to deepening her impact in curriculum and instruction, with doctoral study on the horizon, while staying rooted in the campus work she “completely loves, even when it’s hard.”
If this conversation gave you a useful nudge, follow the show, share it with a colleague, and leave a quick review. Tell us: what’s one leadership habit you’ll change this week?
Connect with Shannon Seale and check out her Tik Tok Lives:
email: shanny.seale@gmail.com
Tik Tok: @mrs.seales
Instagram: @mrs.seales
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00:00 - Meet Principal Shannon Seale
04:03 - Early spark to teach and serve
06:31 - Classroom leadership to leading adults
07:24 - Lessons from bad leadership
10:13 - Confronting conflict and building trust
13:09 - Anti-micromanagement and autonomy
16:32 - Step into administration
18:59 - High school to elementary shift
22:29 - Time, priorities, and teachability
25:39 - Systems for focus and follow-through
28:40 - Walkthroughs, calendars, and delegation
31:32 - Advice for aspiring leaders
34:46 - Team mindset and shared leadership
38:37 - Every role matters in a school
41:21 - Why TikTok: connection and PD
44:20 - Humanizing school leadership online
47:15 - Owning your narrative on social
WEBVTT
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Fun story everybody.
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The first time I came across today's guest is Shannon Seale.
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It wasn't through a conference or a leadership network.
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It was through the TikTok.
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Oh yes, TikTok.
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We have been friends on TikTok for a while, and then I stumbled across one of her posts where she was pondering which college football team was gonna dictate her mood for the next four months.
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And I just started rolling with laughter.
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From there I started following her live TikToks, and I quickly realized this is someone that brings authenticity, energy, and real talk to the work of educational leaders everywhere.
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So I reached out to her and I said, I've gotta have you on the show.
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And here we are.
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Now a little bit about Shannon.
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She's starting her 21st year in education, a journey that spans from teaching high school social studies and graded AP exams to becoming the principal of Odom Elementary School.
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She's got a Bachelor of Arts in Political Science from Baylor University and a Masters of Education from Sam Houston State.
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She loves music, ministry, and making a difference in her community.
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You're gonna love her perspective on leadership.
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Now let's get to the conversation with Shannon Seal.
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Welcome back, everybody, for another episode of the Educational Leadership Podcast.
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Hope you guys are having a great day out there.
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I am so excited today to bring in Shannon Seale.
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I've been watching her on TikTok.
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And so, you know, I'm bringing her on the show.
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I'd like to learn more about her and kind of what got her into the leadership role.
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So, Shannon, welcome to the show.
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Thank you.
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Thanks for having me.
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All right, Shannon.
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I'm gonna go ahead and start you off with the same question I ask everybody else on this show.
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What inspires you to become an educator?
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So I always kind of wanted to be a teacher when I was growing up.
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And I always laughed that that might have been partially because I'm kind of bossy and like to tell people what to do.
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But I as a kid growing up, I always asked my teachers if I could have like the extra worksheets that they had left over.
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And when my friends would come over, I'm surprised I had any friends because I always made them play school with me.
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And my mom was a teacher, she's a dental hygienist, and then she went into teaching dental hygiene.
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And so that was always just kind of, you know, something that was in the forefront of my mind.
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When I went to Baylor, I did my bachelor's degree in political science, and that was not the route I thought I was going to take teaching, but my original plan didn't really pan out.
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And not to say that this was just like a backup plan, but I think it's what I was supposed to do all along.
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I think that's why the original plan didn't work out.
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But I knew I wanted to teach high school and government.
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I had a horrible experience with my high school government teacher, and I knew it was so important.
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And when I was in college and with all these crazy things happening in the world, and kind of at the same time that I was taking these political science classes for the first time, and I was like, this could be really interesting and it's very important.
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So it inspired me to do that particularly.
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And I love kids, I love working with teenagers.
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I worked at a youth camp for several years, and my husband and I were in youth ministry at our church for the last 15.
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So we just love helping kids.
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Awesome.
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It sounds like that's kind of like a natural fit, right?
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So all the past experiences and kind of led into that.
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And, you know, I didn't grow up with educators in my family, but my kids have, and I have one that is in education now.
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So it's kind of neat to see, you know, how being in education inspired the next generation as well.
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So awesome.
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Now you're in high school, you're teaching uh social studies.
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What are some experiences you have as a teacher that helped you with the leadership role?
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What are some leadership roles as a teacher that help you kind of formulate, you know, the leadership that you have today?
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My a lot of the leadership kind of experience that I have didn't necessarily come as a teacher, but I had several other kind of experiences that were put me in leadership positions.
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I was our, what do you call it, our department chair at the last high school where I taught.
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And I did have opportunity at the high school before that to do some curriculum writing.
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So I was able to kind of get into some of those things.
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But a lot of the experiences I had there, I think really helped kind of shape what I do and who I am as a leader.
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I I think one of the biggest things I learned was the importance of diversity.
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And mostly when we talk about that, we think about racial, but I mean diversity of opinion and perspective and thought and experience and all of that, and how much of that plays into the decisions that you make and the counsel that you get and all the things that you do.
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I feel like I've seen a lot of bad leaders, and that kind of inspired me to do things differently, you know, take some of the experiences that I've had and try to do better, be better.
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So yeah, would you say, like watching those leaders that you've kind of watched that you would say, yeah, may not be the best example.
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Uh, what are some things that you learn from to say, hey, maybe not do that?
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One of the things is avoiding conflict.
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So you can't avoid conflicts.
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And I love that analogy that, you know, if you keep sleeping things under the rug, eventually someone will trip over it.
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So you have to, you can't avoid conflict.
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And especially in our job, there's you have to, you know, confront teachers sometimes and you know, parents, and there's so many different angles of things that are, you know, going to come out.
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You can't just ignore the problems.
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So that's been a big thing.
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And another one is you don't want your people to hear from you just whenever it's bad.
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You know, you have to make good connections too.
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And you know, I don't ever want my teachers to say, like, oh, she's here.
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What is she?
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You know, I must, I must have done something wrong.
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You know, I want them to think, you know, oh, she's coming in to say hi and tell me good morning and, you know, um, see how things are going.
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So mostly, you know, only making contact when it's bad and avoiding conflict.
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Those are two big things that I saw that I wanted to make sure I did differently.
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Yeah, that's awesome.
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I know I had a a couple of experiences, not to say that my principals at the time were terrible people.
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They're great people, but there was my first experience as a teacher.
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The only time I really heard from my principal was there was a problem and they wanted to come talk to me about it.
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So I really enjoy that you want to connect with people, not just, hey, I got to do the hard stuff, but I want to connect with you in the good times and the good things as well.
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And I think that's really important uh for our staff and our teachers to see us in those different elements, not just when we have to do the hard stuff and have the tough conversations, but to have the the great conversations and the joy of the job.
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So I really appreciate you sharing that with us today.
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So the other, you know, sorry, the other thing that I just thought of something else.
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The other thing that has really kind of been a huge thing is micromanaging.
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I despise being micromanaged.
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So I always tell my teachers, like, look, this is the end picture of what we want and you know how you decide best to get there as long as it's legal and moral and not going to end this up on Facebook.
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And, you know, as long as I can defend what you're doing, then let's try it, you know.
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But at the same time, you know, some teachers need a lot more and want a lot more hand holding.
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So trying to kind of find that balance between, you know, who needs what and who who wants you to lead them a certain way.
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But I I try with everything I can to not be a micromanager.
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This is the in picture, and you help me decide how we're gonna get there by doing what you know how to do.
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Yeah, I I love that just because, you know, as educational leaders, we, you know, we have a lot of different teachers at a lot of different levels.
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Like we have some master teachers, some teachers that are at the beginning, but at the same time, you don't want to hold their hand.
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You want to give them some, you know, I would say not leeway, but just, you know, some ownership in their classroom and how they do things.
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And so I think it's really important to give them that ability to, you know, try new things and not be afraid to do the do the things that you're asking them to do, but yet know that you're there to support them when they are struggling.
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So I really enjoy that you do that.
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I think a lot of uh great principals have that trait to where they talk to their staff about hey, this is the picture, this is where we want to go, decide how to get there because there's a lot of different avenues, but as long as you do things a certain way, we'll be in good shape.
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So I really appreciate you sharing that with us today.
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So, Shannon, you've been teaching for a while, you went out teaching the high school kids, and now you're in administration.
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Kind of what what inspired you to become an administrator?
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Can you kind of take us in to that first position as a leader in education?
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So the first opportunity I had was at our high school in our district for the to be the interim assistant principal.
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The the principal at the time had become had gotten his superintendent certification and was hired uh at a local district to be the superintendent.
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And so the print the vice principal assistant principal there became the principal.
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And then I wasn't that wasn't even on my radar.
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I was actually our district curriculum specialist at the time.
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And so I'm working in curriculum.
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I've gotten my certification, but I'm, you know, helping supporting teachers all over the district in different grade levels and working in all different kinds of capacities.
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And our superintendent calls me in and it didn't even hit me until about 30 minutes before what she was going to tell me to, you know, she wanted me to do.
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And so I was the interim assistant principal there for about three months.
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And then the opportunity opened up to become the assistant principal at our elementary campus.
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And I was a little terrified because I always taught seniors, and it's it's a pre-K to second campus, but it's been probably the neatest thing I think I've ever done.
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Last year we had a meeting at the end of the year, kind of reflecting on the first full year as principal.
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And she said, What's a big takeaway?
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And I and I I keep saying that it's the hardest thing I've ever just completely loved to do.
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So, and you know, what inspired me to make the move as a teacher, I I had great relationships and great systems and things that I had with my classes, and it was such a small group, you know, and I realized what a bigger influence and I could have as an administrator and not just help students, but help the systems that were in place and that needed to be improved.
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There's a lot of there's a lot of problems in education, and you know, it all I always tell our campus that we're the most important one in the district.
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So um it all trickles up from here.
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So if we don't get it right, no pressure, but yeah, they're gonna be on the trajectory bad trajectory for the rest of their lives.
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So no, I I really appreciate that insight.
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You know, you're going from like a high school level experience into the elementary side as an assistant principal, but then you're now also a building principal today.
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So can you kind of take us to the differences?
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Like, hey, I was at the high school level, I did this three-month assistant principal inter interim position.
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Then I got the assistant principal at the elementary.
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What is well, how was the biggest challenge that you had to go from a high school into an elementary?
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Because, you know, I'm not gonna, I'm I'm not an elementary person.
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I stay secondary.
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I I'm a little not saying I couldn't do it, but I just know it's a different world down there in the elementary.
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How was that, you know, transition from the high school down into the elementary for you?
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It's been a huge learning curve.
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One of the biggest things that I've had to learn is how to talk to people differently.
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And this has been a big part of my, you know, professional growth and all that, but dealing with parents who in in a lot of times are have have kids in school for the first time, you know.
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So they're just learning on how to be parents with school-age kids.
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And we have kids that are coming into pre-K and kindergarten that are just learning how to be students for the first time.
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Whereas, you know, at a high school, you have kids that have been in school for many years.
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And so the transition on especially how to address and approach and deal with issues and talk to students and parents has been one of the biggest lessons that I've learned.
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And but it's important because I'm having those same conversations with teachers now.
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So I feel like that was a good lesson for me to learn because now I'm passing it on to some other people.
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So, but it's very different.
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The kids are very different, and of course, but they still need, you know, to some degree the same thing.
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They need consistency, they need someone who loves them and that is firm, that believes in them, but also has grace, but also is makes sure they know that there's consequences to their actions and all the things that's all you know bubbled in there together.
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So a lot of it's the same.
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They need the same things, it just looks a little bit different.
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Yeah, it does.
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I know it's just going from bigger kids to smaller kids, really.
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And and uh for me, and I have a daughter that's a fifth grade teacher in the Kansas City area, and yeah, I mean, we've we we've talked through some things, some situations, some scenarios, and some things can apply from a secondary and down in the elementary, but it is a little bit different world.
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I look at the elementary teachers of kind of like the jack of all traits and the master of none.
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Uh, so where we're kind of got content specialists up in the secondary area as well.
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So, with that, you know, you've been a principal there for the last few years.
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What are some important things you've learned in the leadership role that maybe, you know, you weren't quite like, wow, I didn't really realize that that was something I would, you know, need to do or know, or you know, maybe you weren't prepared for that part.
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What are some things like or some stories you have that can attest to those things?
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Well, I think I don't know that anything can fully prepare you.
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I one of the assistant principal at our high school had asked me, like, how like did you feel prepared?
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And you know, how long would you have liked to have been an assistant principal before you became principal?
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Ideally, because I think I had like eight months.
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And I said, I don't I don't know that anything can really fully prepare you because there are so many things that I didn't even know were things until I switched desks, you know, switched offices.
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And so I one of the biggest things I think that's important is or that I learned is that I have to be teachable and that I have to listen to other people.
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And I feel like that was an advantage coming from high school to to elementary, is because I I tell them all the time, I'm like, I've never taught second grade reading and you have for 15 years.
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So here's the issue that we need to address.
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What is your opinion on how we can best, you know, tackle this problem?
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And getting all those different perspectives has been very important.
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I think another thing that has been like culture shock is just the amount of time that everything takes.
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And there's so many different things.
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There's so many different things.
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You will never ever have time to do everything.
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And so finding out what the most important things are, what the priorities are, and focusing your time, your limited scarce time on those, you know, major priorities is something that I think was kind of the biggest learning.
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All right.
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So you kind of talk about a lot of different things you weren't like, it's more like, you know, hey, there's you're talking about prioritize.
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You have this over here, this over here.
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How do you have like a systematic way to prioritize things?
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Or like for me, I do lists, I put things on a Google Calendar so I don't forget.
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I'll print off emails and I will put them in a certain location on my desk.
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So and I'll go down the stack of emails to make sure I hit them all because I know that if I don't do that, I'm gonna lose it and I'm not gonna get to it.
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So, do you have any strategies or ways you kind of kind of figure out what's important based off of the priority and what's you need to get to?
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How do you how do you do that?
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Well, one of the things I keep in mind is something my mentor told me the end of last year.
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She retired and I cried buckets of tears.
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But before she left, she told me, just remember your two number one priorities are safety and instruction.
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And so I tried to do everything through those lenses is think of, you know, the safety is the priority, and then making sure that they have good quality instruction and they they leave here knowing how to read and do basic math.
00:17:00.639 --> 00:17:08.000
You know, they're, you know, then then when they go into third grade that they're ready for their star test, you know, and they're ready to be um accomplish things as they move on.
00:17:08.000 --> 00:17:09.839
So I make a lot of lists.
00:17:09.839 --> 00:17:13.599
I have I have diagnosed myself with ADHD this past year.
00:17:13.599 --> 00:17:21.279
I always I got always suspected, but then as all the different things came in, I was like, I really, I really think I have ADHD like very badly.
00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:26.400
So I do everything in Google and Outlook calendar.
00:17:26.400 --> 00:17:32.960
So the teachers give me a hard time and then you know it's Sunday afternoon and they get all the calendar invites for the week, you know.
00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:35.440
It's like I'm just I put everything on the calendar.
00:17:35.440 --> 00:17:37.119
If we have a meeting, it goes on the calendar.
00:17:37.119 --> 00:17:39.680
If a kid has lunch detention, it goes on the calendar.
00:17:39.680 --> 00:17:41.759
If I have a meeting, it goes on the calendar.
00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:43.039
Every single thing.
00:17:43.039 --> 00:17:49.839
And I set a lot of alarms just to make sure that I don't because it's easy to get caught up in all the other things.
00:17:49.839 --> 00:17:57.599
And I, you know, by the time I oh, I was gonna get into this classroom and you know, observe this teacher and she wanted some feedback on her classroom management.
00:17:57.599 --> 00:18:03.039
So I intended to do that in her morning block, but then I got tied up with these emails and things I'm doing.
00:18:03.039 --> 00:18:13.440
So just I set a lot of alarms, I set outlook calendar, I make a lot of lists, and I always, if anything comes my way, I try to remember those two top priorities in terms of what my job is.
00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:15.200
And then I try to delegate some things too.
00:18:15.200 --> 00:18:17.279
I've got an awesome assistant principal.
00:18:17.279 --> 00:18:19.839
I only have her there though, two and a half days a week.
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I share her with another campus.
00:18:21.839 --> 00:18:27.680
And so, but whenever she's there, a lot of the discipline things, you know, she is able to do.
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And I am able to focus more on those things that, you know, that I really need to be doing.
00:18:32.720 --> 00:18:36.720
So I don't know if that's a great answer, but that's kind of how I keep it straight in my mind.
00:18:36.720 --> 00:18:39.200
I'm still learning, I'm still trying to figure out all the systems.
00:18:39.440 --> 00:18:46.240
Oh, I think you you hit on some great things there, utilizing some technology there to kind of keep your days squared up.
00:18:46.240 --> 00:18:50.559
I know for me, I have to put down my meetings and the different things that pop up.
00:18:50.559 --> 00:18:56.559
And one thing that I've done differently this year is I'll block time for my walkthroughs.
00:18:56.559 --> 00:19:03.279
And that's something that I always struggled with getting to because I always get derailed with something.
00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:08.720
So what I did is I just started going, and we're in a block schedule at the high school where I'm at.
00:19:08.720 --> 00:19:13.599
So I will go, okay, this is the block that I'm going to dedicate towards walkthroughs.
00:19:13.599 --> 00:19:17.279
And so I'll have my little cards with my teachers and their schedules on it.
00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:25.599
And so I'll pick three for the day, and that'll, you know, I'll do it during that time, and then I'll write up their little walkthrough, and then I'm done.
00:19:25.599 --> 00:19:30.400
Like, and I try to do that about three times a week out of the five days.
00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:35.599
I try to get three of those, you know, dedicated times into the classroom.
00:19:35.599 --> 00:19:40.480
And and so far I've I've hit everybody's up to this point, and and it's worked out well.
00:19:40.480 --> 00:19:48.160
And so I really appreciate you sharing kind of those different ways and how you keep yourself organized, because I think that's important.
00:19:48.160 --> 00:19:55.200
You know, we're people if you're not staying organized, you know, things will slip their and things will slip for the cracks even if you are organized.
00:19:55.200 --> 00:19:57.279
So it's just just the way it happens.
00:19:57.279 --> 00:20:02.799
And you know, as you know, being an educational leader, you'll have all the plans in the world.
00:20:02.799 --> 00:20:09.759
But then at the same time, when something hits that you have to take care of like right away, you gotta attend to it.
00:20:09.759 --> 00:20:22.000
And so, you know, I know for me, just this past few weeks, I feel like I've had some fire hose moments, you know, like I have my plan, but it doesn't quite work out the way I want it to as well.
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:29.119
So, with you being a you know, building principal for the last few years, you've been an assistant principal as well.
00:20:29.119 --> 00:20:36.240
What advice would you give people that are aspiring to become an assistant principal or principal?
00:20:36.240 --> 00:20:40.319
What advice would you give them before they take that leap?
00:20:40.880 --> 00:20:43.599
Um, the time management is definitely a huge thing.
00:20:43.599 --> 00:20:49.599
Figure out what the priorities are, but then also, like I mentioned before, be teachable and be humble.
00:20:49.599 --> 00:20:52.160
Realize that you don't have all the answers.
00:20:52.160 --> 00:21:02.720
And there are people, there are teachers there that could probably do your job better than you could, or at least they know more about, you know, the level and the things that they're teaching than than than you might.
00:21:02.720 --> 00:21:13.599
And so always listen to the people that you have around you, seek advice from people that you probably aren't going to agree with, that you know you may not agree with, because they can give you a really good perspective.
00:21:13.599 --> 00:21:23.759
And just always so there's one of the ladies that is our in the district person that she's on our campus, like her office is on our campus, and she actually used to be the principal at the elementary school there.
00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:29.759
And so when I have like I I kind of have tend to have these big crazy ideas sometimes.
00:21:29.759 --> 00:21:32.400
And so I'll usually go and I'm like, What do you think?
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And sometimes she's like, I like it.
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And one time she was like, That's a bad idea.
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And I was like, Okay, so tell me why.
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And she told me she's like, I'm sorry.
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I'm like, don't apologize.
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