Jan. 12, 2026

Episode 57: Nebraska Education Advocacy: How the 2026 Legislative Session Will Impact Schools with Dr. Mike Dulaney & Tim Heckenlively

Send us a text Laws that feel distant in a statehouse become very real in a classroom. We sit down with Dr. Mike Dulaney of the Nebraska Council of School Administrators and consultant Tim Heckenlively to map what the new legislative session actually means for students, teachers, and leaders, and how your voice can change it. From a projected $470M budget shortfall to hot-button bills on option enrollment and school surveillance, we walk through the decisions most likely to hit your building ...

Send us a text

Laws that feel distant in a statehouse become very real in a classroom. We sit down with Dr. Mike Dulaney of the Nebraska Council of School Administrators and consultant Tim Heckenlively to map what the new legislative session actually means for students, teachers, and leaders, and how your voice can change it. From a projected $470M budget shortfall to hot-button bills on option enrollment and school surveillance, we walk through the decisions most likely to hit your building and the strategies that help you influence them.

We dig into school finance pressures and the hard truth that education sits among the largest appropriations, making it vulnerable when revenue dips. Mike and Tim outline why one-size-fits-all mandates fail districts with very different realities, and how to frame a clear, local case for flexibility, especially on complex issues like accepting high‑needs students when services are already at capacity. We also explore a potential shift in retirement rules from a 180‑day to a 120‑day separation, the strong funding status of Nebraska’s plan, and what that means for contributions and staffing.

Safety and privacy take center stage in a thoughtful look at cameras, data governance, and parent expectations. You’ll hear why coalitions among administrators, boards, and teachers drive credibility, and how term-limited senators create urgency around legacy proposals, including culture-war topics likely to resurface. The conversation closes with solutions to the teacher shortage: practical grow‑your‑own pathways that pair content expertise with structured, on‑the‑job training so schools can staff hard‑to‑fill roles without lowering standards.

The throughline is agency. Invite your senator to tour classrooms. Share specific impacts, not abstractions. Keep it civil, local, and actionable. Subscribe for more policy-to-practice conversations, share this with a colleague who cares about schools, and leave a review to help others find these insights. Your story can steer the next vote.

Connect with NCSA (Nebraska Council of School Administrators):

NCSA Website:

NCSA Legislative Website:

Email Dr. Mike Dulaney: mike.dulaney@ncsa.org

Email Tim Heckenlively: tim.heckenlively@ncsa.org

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00:00 - Why Advocacy Beats Silence

05:00 - Session Outlook And Budget Shortfall

09:05 - School Finance Pressure And Property Taxes

11:16 - Option Enrollment And Special Education

19:49 - Term Limits And Legacy Bills

23:54 - Building Relationships With Senators

31:16 - Retirement Rule Change: 180 To 120 Days

39:40 - Plan Funding And Contributions Explained

44:08 - Surveillance, Data, And School Safety

50:59 - Culture War Proposals On The Horizon

54:44 - Coalitions And Teacher Shortage Solutions

01:01:04 - Grow‑Your‑Own Pathways For Teachers

WEBVTT

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Every decision made in a state capital eventually walks through the doors of our school building.

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And the people who feel those decisions first, the students, teachers, and administrations are often the last ones heard.

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Today we're changing that.

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I'm very excited to have Dr.

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Mike Dulaney and Mr.

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Tim Heckenlively on the show.

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With the 109th Nebraska legislation session to begin, in this case, it's already started.

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Education will once again be front and center.

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Bills will be introduced, policies will be debated, and the people shaping those decisions need to hear from the people doing the work every day, which is you and me.

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Dr.

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Mike Dulaney is the executive director of the Nebraska Council of School Administrators and one of the most trusted voices when it comes to education policy in our state.

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And Mr.

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Tim Heckenlively is an educational consultant and former superintendent of Fall City's public schools who brings years of on-the-ground leadership and experience navigating how legislation plays out in real schools with real students.

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In this episode, we'll explore what to expect during the 109th legislative session, why educators must stay informed and involved, how to build relationships with your local state senators, how to advocate effectively without stepping into partisanship, and how your influence as an educator can give lawmakers the perspective they haven't yet considered.

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This isn't politics, this is advocacy, the kind that protects students, supports teachers, and strengthens schools.

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Now let's get to the conversation with Dr.

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Mike Delaney and Mr.

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Tim Hecken lively.

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So, you know, it's going to be really geared towards that.

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But I think there's a lot of things that are important in this conversation because this past summer in June of 2025 actually went to the educational advocacy workshop that the state of Nebraska or the NCSA put on.

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And I got to work with Mr.

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or Dr.

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Dulaney and actually uh met Tim through that process and got to learn about how the legislation works because I got sick and tired of state legislation getting passed to where I'm like, it's coming down on me to uphold some of this stuff.

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And some of it I feel like is just like, really, what can we do to help with that?

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How can we be more involved and be more proactive?

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So without further ado, I'd like to welcome in Dr.

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Mike Dulaney and Tim Hecken lively.

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Welcome to the show, guys.

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Hey, thank you, thank you.

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Appreciate it.

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And we really appreciate the opportunity to talk to your audience about the Nebraska legislature, some of the issues that we anticipate coming up.

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And then Tim, I'm sure, will jump in as well.

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Tim is a first-year lobbyist.

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And so I joked with him that thing about a lobbyist is your rookie year is more like a two-year deal where because you have to go through a 90-day session and a 60-day session to really get a feel for how things work.

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So he'll be with me at the Capitol starting Wednesday.

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So Wednesday, the 7th of January, is the opening day of the 2026 session.

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And it's a short session, so it's 60 days in length, which sounds not all that long, but it drags out for a good four months.

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So four months to cover 60 business days of the session.

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So we will we anticipate the legislature will first and foremost deal with a budget shortfall, which they have to deal with by constitutional mandate.

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And that's going to be a good $470 million to deal with in the red.

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But I have a feeling by the end of February, when the Economic Forecast Advisory Board gets together, that's the special board that determines exactly how our revenue is coming in or not coming in in the state of Nebraska.

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And they that's what determines what kind of shortfall we have.

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My guess is when they do get together late February, they're going to determine that revenue is not coming in as it should, and that that budget shortfall is actually going to be bigger than $470 million.

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So not good news, not good forecast, but that's what that's what we're anticipating.

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It could be devastating if they come together and say it's not a half million, a billion, it's a billion or whatever, and then all of a sudden state government is scrambling.

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Legislature has to deal with this.

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They can't just say, hey, we'll deal with it uh next year.

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They have got to balance the budget, and that means either more revenue source, which we kind of doubt would happen, or cuts, and that's what we worry about.

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Uh so the three largest appropriations for our state budget every year is TIOSA, that's the equalization formula, and then the university, which is a huge amount of uh appropriation, and then Medicaid.

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And so I don't know what to predict exactly, but I worry the fact that education is one of those major thumbs that could get the hammer, and that would mean bad news for for our schools.

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And Mike, that is, you're absolutely right, that is going to be the top priority.

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Everything we've been hearing as the legislative session gets geared up here in Nebraska, the different media sources are starting to interview the senators.

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That's that's the number one thing on everybody's mind.

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And with that kind of a deficit, the only way to get at that is going to be cuts.

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And so I haven't really heard as far as just like education-related issues.

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Not uh there's not a lot of that surfacing yet.

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I mean, the the number one thing we just keep hearing over and over going into this session is just dealing with the state's budget.

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That's right.

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Uh so you know that last year they created a special school finance commission to examine the current formula, what could be done to change it.

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That commission is still meeting, and uh it's unknown whether they're gonna have something in the way of legislation this session or not.

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I frankly don't know for sure.

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But even if there was legislation on the formula, I'm not sure there would be any financial resource available to put more money towards education.

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What we're worried about is quite the opposite is them taking money away, not adding to.

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And of course, we know all this time the heavy reliance upon property taxes to fund education can only be solved if you add more money to to the the state tab, and that would allow schools to have less reliance on property tax, much easier said than done.

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So I don't know if anything will be introduced on school finance.

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I've heard some things, but I'm not sure if it's true.

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It seems unlikely.

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It seems like that's a a bad place to start on on issues when we have such a budget shortfall.

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You know, but we do believe we're fairly confident that one of the issues that will come up again this year is option enrollment and special education students.

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We have a feeling that's where they left off last year, and there are some very strong opinions about that within the legislature.

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There are some senators like Sam who just don't believe a school should ever say no when it comes to an option student, especially a SPED student.

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The answer should always be yes.

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We'll take that kid.

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Of course, the reality is that a school district may not have the resources to help that student.

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So, and and then there's other instances when they simply say we are full, we cannot take any more students.

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So we have a feeling that issue is gonna come back once again.

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There is a pending bill, LB 653, which could be the vehicle they use, but we're fairly confident that issue is gonna come up once again.

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Yeah, it is, and that's uh certainly we've talked about that being a slippery slope as far as advocacy because it goes, because we don't want to come across as oh no, we're in favor of schools denying an education to children, but yet you know, we have to work to help other people and understand the ramifications to a school district to serve students, especially high-need students, work for special education services.

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And uh, you know, I think Jeff, you probably remember one of the key points from the advocacy academy was Dr.

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Delaney always saying, you know, if it's a bad deal, don't try to make it better, if you remember.

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But I do think we we've had the discussion, this was going to be one of those bills that we're gonna really have to dive into and you know, what can we digest and work with, and what can we not?

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And because this was coming back, and I think that it's going to have a lot of momentum.

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And so we're we this was a time we're going to have to make make some things work here on behalf of the educators in Nebraska.

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Yeah, I'm gonna I kind of want to say something on this one because I know this is coming up, and I sit at the principal seat, and so I've had these discussions, and I understand, like, okay, as educators, we want to help as many people as we can, right?

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We don't want to deny people, but I also understand on the parent side, because I have a brother that's trying to option enroll his kid into a school, and they have said no because they're full.

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But I also understand the school side of why, you know, we don't want to stretch as a principal, I don't want to stretch the resources we have too thin because if we can't, you know, have the people, if we can't take care of the people we have, it's gonna be even harder for us to take care of more people on top of that.

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I think coming from a principal standpoint, you know, I see kind of like we want to be able to help all these kids as best as we can.

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If we have the resources and we can make it happen, let's do it, right?

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Let's have those kids come in, let's educate them.

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We do that.

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We bring kids in from other districts in my school here at Hastings that have special needs and we try to accommodate that.

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But at the same time, we also don't want to stretch our staff so far thin to where we're putting more burden on our staff when our resources become limited.

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So I kind of see both sides on this.

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I'm kind of an advocacy.

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I'm kind of like, let the schools make the decisions, what's best for them, because the natural heart of public education is to help as many kids as we can to get educated.

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And that's kind of where I'm at with it when it comes to this issue, because I can see like, hey, that school's got a program that I can go to that helps my child and they'll be better fit over there than the school they're in.

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I get that as well.

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I've also been a small school rule principal where I'm asking schools, could you help me with this?

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And it's like, no, figure it out.

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And I've been on that side too.

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So I've been on both sides of this issue when it comes to just being a principal trying to get help for a kid in that situation, or to help kids that are in that situation.

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So it's a very fine balance and hacked.

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And like you said, you don't want to have this perception of we don't want to help kids.

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We do, but at the same time, we got to be able to have the resources and things available so we can do that.

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And I think that sometimes people get those things kind of lost in the fog or the haze of that.

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So if you guys would like to expand more, that's kind of like my take on it, my my little principal take.

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But I don't know where where you guys are at with that.

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Right.

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Well, I think you know, in the past, school districts have had flexibility and for local decisions.

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And you know, in in a state with over 200 school districts, you know, ranging from rural to urban, everybody is in a different situation when it comes to this.

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And a bill that's one size fits all, uh, it just isn't it really isn't going to work.

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And so we really want to advocate for that flexibility, that local decision making when it comes to you know, just option enrollment piece.

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Well said.

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So we're coming into a session, and and this harkens back to both of you who went through the academy and we talked about this.

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That there in many cases there are catalysts that drive an issue.

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It could be a lawsuit, a pending lawsuit, it could be any number of things.

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Well, we got one this coming session.

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We have a number of senators that are term limited after this legislative session.

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They they'll be out, gone.

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What we've experienced since term limits went into effect in the year 2000, we have seen this time again where the senator coming into his or her last session, they're desperate.

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That's the catalyst.

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They're desperate to get something done.

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Maybe an issue that they've been working on for the past eight years and they just haven't got it got it past the finish line.

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So there's the catalyst will be for lack of a better word, panic to get something done on a given issue, and they're gonna be trying like crazy because that that's maybe their legacy on a given issue.

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And so they're gonna want to get something done.

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Well, we know some of the senators leaving.

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For example, Senator Merman, this is his last session, the issue we just talked about, that's on his list.

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He may want to really pursue that issue more than anything.

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The other issue that came up last session was and we're we're not here to criticize our friends in the private school sector because we value private schools, we need private schools.

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But there was a piece of legislation that would have allowed or required schools to have policies to if a student wants to leave the school and go for go to another facility for religious instruction so that they may do that.

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And we found that to be problematic because we we were not sure if that was best for the school operations to have kids just leave the premises and go, but that issue never was adopted, and it came out of committee, but it was not adopted.

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Senator Merman is very big on that topic.

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He's also big on the topic of Ten Commandments being posted in the school, so that legislation is still hanging out there.

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You know what I'm saying is this session is unique because this is the last, it's the final hurrah for a number of these senators, and they're gonna want to accomplish something, and they're gonna be pushing very, very hard on whatever that issue may be.

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And that means that the school lobby, lobbyists like Tim, myself, we're gonna have to be very vigilant about what's happening.

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And if there are issues that we feel are negative for public schools, we're gonna have to fight like hot crazy to prevent bad policy from going to effect.

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Yep.

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It's really interesting.

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You talked about Senator Merman.

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Actually, had him come tour my building probably about maybe a month, month and a half ago, maybe now, to where he was invited by our Hastings Education Association.

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I got wind of it.

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I knew he was coming to my building, so I gave him a tour.

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We talked about things, and it was really nice because I knew he was the guy, uh the chair for the education side.

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And so I was able to kind of talk to him about the upcoming stuff.

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I know what he's looking at, and so I was able to have those conversations.

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I was able to have him talk to teachers and say, hey, this is how this would affect us.

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This is, you know, and something I'll, you know, I don't know if I'll say this because his daughter actually came to Hastings Public School to be taught in our transition program.

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So we've actually had his kid come here and we've worked with him.

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That was long before I came into the picture, long before I was a principal.

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But to be able to have that conversation and to have him in our building, have him do that little tour was really good.

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I also was able to bring in our senator, current senator of Adams County, Dan Lanowski.

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And he's a guy I've known for a long time because he's coach wrestling.

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He's out at Adams Central.

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And so we had a really great conversation and a good tour of the building.

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And so that was something that actually I took from the workshop was meeting with these senators, having invited them to come in, actually have conversations, show them the work we're actually doing, and then maybe have some conversations on, hey, this piece of legislation is gonna affect us this way, and try to get them to think about that.

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So that's something I actually got to be able to do this past month and a half to have those conversations.

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So I don't know if it's gonna, I mean, I'm hoping it helps, but those are things that I have been more aware of since that advocacy workshop.

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And I'm trying to help the process of through that.

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So with that said, I really appreciate you kind of talking about that because I didn't realize it was his last legislation session.

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So I can see why he wants to like maybe push some things, but at the same time, I think if it's good for education, we're gonna, we're gonna say, yeah, this is be this makes sense.

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But also if it's something that we got to figure out a compromise or something that we got to figure out a middle ground on where we could both win, that's something to think about too.

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Or if it's just bad legislation, it's bad legislation.

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So that's something to think of.

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There's a lot of things to think about when you're talking about these things.

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So I really appreciate you guys bringing that point up about that.

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What other pieces of legislation do you feel like maybe are hot?

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Yeah, can I can I cut kind of cut in real quick?

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Yeah, go ahead, Tim.

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You hit on a key point there with your advocacy, you know, coming from a background myself and you know, being in your shoes as a principal, then also serving as superintendent, you know, you know, I did a lot, I followed very closely Dr.

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Delaney's legislative updates.

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You know, I I took that stuff to heart.

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I, you know, talked to the teachers about that.

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I talked to the school board, the other administrators.

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But what you did, you know, you the great thing there is your boots on the ground, you know, and for you to take those opportunities to talk to those senators outside of the session, outside of a hearing, you're establishing relationships, but they're hearing, they're hearing from somebody that's every day in the trenches.

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And that's the important thing for school administrators.

00:21:36.899 --> 00:21:38.259
To understand.

00:21:38.259 --> 00:21:41.779
And I'm really glad that you took that from the advocacy training.

00:21:41.779 --> 00:21:52.019
And because those are the key pieces where you can make a difference and embracing those opportunities when you said, Hey, I see the senator's going to be in the school.

00:21:52.019 --> 00:21:54.419
You know, I'm going to, you know, set up my tour.

00:21:54.419 --> 00:22:00.579
And I'm sure you were able to burn his ear on a few things and show him some things you're dealing with, and that's what they need to hear.

00:22:00.579 --> 00:22:01.779
So great job on that.

00:22:01.939 --> 00:22:02.099
Yeah.

00:22:02.099 --> 00:22:03.859
I agree with that.

00:22:03.859 --> 00:22:06.019
And Jeff, I know you had done that.

00:22:06.019 --> 00:22:07.699
I think that was very, very smart.

00:22:07.699 --> 00:22:18.419
And that's a good advocacy tool because you the policymaker is right in your environment and seeing is believing.

00:22:18.419 --> 00:22:41.459
And when you take that senator around and say, Here's uh our wonderful teacher who teaches uh this or that and they're having a conversation, or or you take them in to talk to a special ed teacher, and she's able to say out loud, I'm exhausted, I'm working like crazy, I can't do more than I'm doing.

00:22:41.459 --> 00:22:48.579
Seeing is believing, and if they hear those things and they see those things, then they have to deal with it.

00:22:48.579 --> 00:22:52.259
I mean, and that's where we ran into problems for so many years.

00:22:52.259 --> 00:23:03.699
Some lawmakers, many of whom are term-limited now, did not want to tour the school because they did not want to hear it, they did not want to see it, and they were able to deny it.

00:23:03.699 --> 00:23:18.819
And then on the floor, they would say, Well, I don't believe this or that, and they were able to deny anybody who would say things about how stressed people are, whatever, because they didn't hear it themselves, they don't want to hear it.

00:23:18.819 --> 00:23:23.379
I think advocates like you, Jeff, out there bringing people right into the building.

00:23:23.379 --> 00:23:30.819
Merman has always been, as far as I know, always been willing to go to a school and and listen.

00:23:30.819 --> 00:23:37.059
I hear Senator Lineski is the same way that he was a retired teacher.

00:23:37.059 --> 00:23:42.099
So I think he probably enjoys going to school and see what's going on.

00:23:42.099 --> 00:23:49.939
I wish we had all lawmakers that way, but our hands will be probably filled with other issues as well.

00:23:49.939 --> 00:24:19.619
We have, for example, a retirement issue, and I think it's gonna come to a boil this session, and it has to do with the number of days required for a school employee to remain unemployed in the school environment to demonstrate that they have bona fide separation away from the school and that they are really retired.

00:24:19.619 --> 00:24:31.539
For a long time, people would retire, but they'd come right back, and there was some question about whether there was a deal ahead of time to give them a job, and so they didn't really retire.

00:24:31.539 --> 00:24:37.299
And that of course would be fraud, not to to say you're gonna retire and then you don't.

00:24:37.299 --> 00:24:41.539
So the 180-day wait period was put in place.

00:24:41.539 --> 00:24:44.739
Actually, before that, it was 360 days.

00:24:44.739 --> 00:24:54.899
So 180 is what we have right now, and through my conversations and meetings, this this interim period, the idea was floated.

00:24:54.899 --> 00:24:58.899
What about 120 days, which is less?

00:24:58.899 --> 00:25:07.139
The difference is in that 120, it's no work, so no substitute teaching, and no volunteer work.

00:25:07.139 --> 00:25:15.299
You retire and you're gone and you're out, and then after 120 days, you would be able to come back in some capacity.

00:25:15.299 --> 00:25:23.379
And our legislative committee, we're we're not unlike any other nonprofit association.

00:25:23.379 --> 00:25:28.739
We have a legislative committee that gets together and they give direction to Tim and I.

00:25:28.739 --> 00:25:38.099
So what bills they want to support and oppose, and we basically do the the the bidding, the will of that committee.

00:25:38.099 --> 00:25:41.459
I don't know what what they're gonna say about the 120 days.

00:25:41.459 --> 00:26:29.680
We know from talking to our members all summer long and through the fall that they generally like the idea.

00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:30.879
Generally, yeah, they do.

00:26:32.160 --> 00:26:50.799
There were a few that had questions, and and you know what it means is, for example, if a teacher who's gonna retire and really wanted to substitute teach right away, under the current law, they they can do that up to eight days per month during the 180-day period.

00:26:50.799 --> 00:26:53.440
With this new proposal, they would not.

00:26:53.440 --> 00:27:00.480
So we had some say, look, I have a teacher who's gonna retire, she wants to come right back to substitute teachers.

00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:03.359
Under this proposal, she would not be able to do that.

00:27:03.359 --> 00:27:16.399
So, yeah, there could be a burden, but the the trade-off is they'd be able to return sooner than later, and might help in that regard.

00:27:16.399 --> 00:27:22.399
So I don't know where our committee will come down on it, but that proposal will be out there.

00:27:22.399 --> 00:27:26.480
We uh will probably have a whole host of education issues.

00:27:26.480 --> 00:27:38.480
The thing about Nebraska that's unique is that every single bill that's introduced gets a public hearing or what I would like to call their day in court.

00:27:38.480 --> 00:27:42.720
So it could be a bill that in our opinion is absolutely crazy.

00:27:42.720 --> 00:27:51.920
Who would support, but it still gets an opportunity to be heard, which means we need to respond and be prepared to respond.

00:27:51.920 --> 00:28:01.839
Because any idea that just because we think it it sounds crazy, hey, it it still has a chance, and so we have to treat it as though it would.

00:28:03.519 --> 00:28:14.240
I know, like the 120 days, 180 days, I'm kind of mixed on that as a principal because I did have someone that retired was able to sub within that 180 days, and it helps us.

00:28:14.240 --> 00:28:22.319
So I mean, but at the same time, if you think about it, like I did the teacher, you know, they may be done May 31st, you know.

00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:24.399
I mean, they start retirement on June 1st.

00:28:24.399 --> 00:28:27.359
So that doesn't that doesn't seem so terrible.

00:28:27.359 --> 00:28:33.279
I mean, 120 days from like June 1st, you're talking June, July, maybe sometime in September, right?

00:28:33.279 --> 00:28:38.079
They can come back and do some stuff, which isn't that far into the school year.

00:28:38.079 --> 00:28:46.879
Also, like this on, but I also look at it as what if it's somebody like on my contract, I'm July 1 through January or June 31st.

00:28:46.879 --> 00:28:49.759
Wow, that 120 days starts July 1.

00:28:49.759 --> 00:28:54.240
It takes me a little longer to get to that part, but um to help out.

00:28:54.240 --> 00:28:56.160
So I think you know, that's something to think about.

00:28:56.160 --> 00:28:59.519
You know, it's you know, I'm about 11 years from retirement.

00:28:59.519 --> 00:29:01.599
So, you know, it's it'd be interesting.

00:29:01.599 --> 00:29:03.599
I I could go either way on this.

00:29:03.599 --> 00:29:21.519
Um, I think it would be you know beneficial in some aspects, but at the same time, I mean I think that'll bring that issue up because Jeff, you Senator Leneski, your senator, this was his big concern, his first year in the legislature.

00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:34.720
He brought a bill LB689 to deal with this because he thought, wait a minute, I have teachers who they want to go in and substitute way more than eight days per month, and why are they being held back?

00:29:34.720 --> 00:29:54.639
Well, we explained to him, hey, it has to do with the IRS, it has to do with definitely demonstrating that you are retired, that you have quit being a teacher full time, and so there has to be a demonstration for purposes of IRS, otherwise, you know, we could get in trouble.

00:29:54.639 --> 00:29:56.720
So he understood all that.

00:29:56.720 --> 00:30:02.240
He may very well be the sponsor of the bill we're talking about.

00:30:02.240 --> 00:30:16.960
So that's another education issue that doesn't cost anything, so that's why I think the bill actually has a chance that any bill introduced this session that has a price tag to it is likely to be DOA.

00:30:16.960 --> 00:30:27.200
This bill I just talked about is an example of a bill that wouldn't cost the state anything, and so we feel it probably would have a fairly good chance.

00:30:27.200 --> 00:30:34.879
It's interesting that the retirement agency itself, when we talked to them, they were enthusiastic.

00:30:34.879 --> 00:30:36.000
Why?

00:30:36.000 --> 00:30:56.960
It's less work for them because they're not having to go in and check on substitute teacher XYZ, who may or may not know that she already tested or subsitute taught eight days that month, so it's less uh scrutiny on the part of in-person.

00:30:56.960 --> 00:31:00.240
So we we got great reviews from them.

00:31:00.319 --> 00:31:03.519
They like it sounds like a clean break, you know what I mean?

00:31:03.519 --> 00:31:07.599
Like it sounds just like it's cleaner, there's not as much gray in that area.

00:31:07.599 --> 00:31:11.680
There's like you know, like you just know 120 days, boom, you're done.

00:31:11.680 --> 00:31:13.599
And I think a lot of people like that idea.

00:31:13.599 --> 00:31:20.240
I kind of like it too, but I'm like sitting there thinking, well, might see, you know, but at the same time, yeah.

00:31:20.240 --> 00:31:32.079
But at the same time, at the same time, if they're able to start subbing as many days as they can September one, I mean, that's not too far into the school year anyway.

00:31:32.079 --> 00:31:35.920
So would get them a lot more in that regard as well.

00:31:35.920 --> 00:31:39.440
If you just have that hard break, and then you can get rocking and rolling.

00:31:39.519 --> 00:31:54.879
So honestly, I do think I I think Jeff, as a principal, you just have to you look at okay, I'm gonna have to live by for about a month, that first month of school, but also understanding that normally you have fairly good attendance, or you hope you have good attendance with your teachers.

00:31:54.879 --> 00:32:05.119
And if it's a if it's a planned long-term absence, you know, most of the time over the summer or the pri previous spring, you can make arrangements for that.

00:32:05.119 --> 00:32:23.440
But it does clean everything up specifically for the Nebraska public employees retirement system, especially in the fact that Mike, I don't, I don't think that they they have their rules and their uh their bylaws, but I don't believe they have a any kind of a compliance department.

00:32:23.440 --> 00:32:28.480
That's kind of up to the member, and the member can get themselves in trouble by law.

00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:29.759
It's up to the member.

00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:37.359
I was part of legislation decades ago where we made sure the onus is on the employee, not the employer.

00:32:37.359 --> 00:32:44.079
They have to keep track of how many days they were substitute teaching and and be honest with in-verse.

00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:50.319
But in person still has to devote a whole lot of time managing that that whole thing.

00:32:50.319 --> 00:32:54.480
So this would be a win-win, in our opinion.

00:32:54.480 --> 00:32:59.680
I guess we'll see if I'm relatively certain the bill's gonna get introduced.

00:32:59.680 --> 00:33:10.160
I'm relatively certain that Senator Lineski will be a part of that, and then it's just a matter of our committee weighing you know that bill and deciding what they're gonna direct Tim and I to do.

00:33:10.160 --> 00:33:10.799
Yeah, Dr.

00:33:10.960 --> 00:33:26.559
Delaney, have you have you heard anything about I know how things operate here in Nebraska and with the different Nebraska public organizations, like with the counties, the judges, and you know, they all have that, you know, 120 days.

00:33:26.559 --> 00:33:32.639
But outside of the state of Nebraska, have you heard anything on how other states or what their days are it's a real mixed bag.

00:33:32.879 --> 00:33:40.960
You have some states that have as low, I believe, as 30 days, others with 60, some with 90.

00:33:40.960 --> 00:33:43.279
It's all over the place.

00:33:43.279 --> 00:34:09.119
I think what you know, as we talk to in-person and hear from them, we the the thing that would spark the IRS attention, and by the way, you don't want to ever catch their attention, you just want to let it be under the radar, and you don't want the compliance audit to get nasty because we have a compliance audit done by the IRS ever so often.

00:34:09.119 --> 00:34:28.000
And I think what would look strange is if those other plans that you mentioned, the county of the state that have 120 days, and then we have a bill to make it 90, I would think that would be a glaring problem that that the IRS would take notice.

00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:41.599
I'm not saying that it couldn't, it would never be 90, but I have a feeling that our best bet is to be if we're gonna change it to make it consistent with a number that already exists.

00:34:41.599 --> 00:34:51.519
Right now, I would say the schools have a good argument that, hey, that's not fair to us that we have 180, and these other plans in Nebraska have 120.

00:34:51.519 --> 00:34:57.920
So our best bet would be to pursue 120 at this point and and be consistent.

00:34:57.920 --> 00:35:12.160
Uh the good news on the retirement front, the plan is doing exceedingly well, 100 almost 103% funded funding ratio, which is outstanding by any measurement.

00:35:12.160 --> 00:35:24.160
We have a new system now based to it really was based on uh wanting the the state to get off the hook because they want they currently have to make a contribution of 2%.

00:35:24.160 --> 00:35:25.840
They did not want to do that.

00:35:25.840 --> 00:35:35.280
It was a budget-cutting measure to uh say if the plan is doing very well, then the state doesn't have to contribute a dollar.

00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:38.079
And and that's the way we are right now.

00:35:38.079 --> 00:35:49.440
So the good news is that even the employee and the employer pay in less contribution for each member than they did before, and over two percent less for now.

00:35:49.519 --> 00:35:50.079
Yeah, right.

00:35:50.079 --> 00:35:59.680
You know, that both for the employer and the employee, that's been you know, a direct positive impact on their paycheck.

00:35:59.680 --> 00:36:00.240
Exactly.

00:36:00.400 --> 00:36:07.039
Yeah, so I saw a little bit extra money in my paycheck when that when it went down to eight percent.

00:36:07.519 --> 00:36:12.400
I I do, I think educators saw that and they're like, Oh, how why did that happen?

00:36:12.400 --> 00:36:16.000
Because you know, the negotiated raises and stuff hadn't kicked in yet.

00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:16.400
Right.

00:36:16.400 --> 00:36:25.119
Well, but everybody was able to see that, and I and I believe has it's already been set or determined that that's going to continue for another year.

00:36:25.519 --> 00:36:26.880
Was that said in November?

00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:46.640
Yeah, so the way they have it set, and we we actually helped with that legislation when it was coming through, is that by November of each year, the state actuary would tell the public employees retirement board what the anticipated change, if any, would be in the funding ratio.

00:36:46.640 --> 00:36:56.240
And if it's over 100% as it is, then the state does not have any obligation to pay a dime into the plans.

00:36:56.240 --> 00:37:05.120
They're off the hook, and that's what the state wanted to be is off the hook, because I would say a big chunk of money going towards the school plan.

00:37:05.120 --> 00:37:11.280
It also would automatically mean a lower rate for the employee and the employer.

00:37:11.280 --> 00:37:21.600
Um, if the plan dips below 100%, then we go back up a little bit and the state resumes its obligation to pay in a little bit.

00:37:21.600 --> 00:37:22.880
So it works like that.

00:37:22.880 --> 00:37:32.960
And then if we dip below a certain threshold, we could be back up to closer to the numbers that we were uh originally.

00:37:32.960 --> 00:37:36.880
So it's you know, it seems to be a good plan.

00:37:36.880 --> 00:37:42.000
We're still in the first year of implementation, so I guess time will tell.

00:37:42.800 --> 00:37:43.600
All right, guys.

00:37:43.600 --> 00:37:48.400
So, what other educational legislation do you guys foresee maybe coming up?

00:37:48.400 --> 00:38:02.800
We've talked about you know quite a few of them already, but what's something out there that may be flying under the radar that may pop up that we may not be anticipating, or something that you think might get some legs coming into this session?

00:38:03.200 --> 00:38:12.160
Well, one of the things that I I talk in our advocacy academy is what I call the lull.

00:38:12.160 --> 00:38:16.240
It occurs every 60-day short session.

00:38:16.240 --> 00:38:28.160
The first several weeks within a 60-day session, like we're coming into, it's when you have all this pending carryover legislation from the previous 90-day session.

00:38:28.160 --> 00:38:32.960
It's just sitting there, it's sitting there on general file or it's sitting in committee.

00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:41.440
And so the legislature has got to have something to do until new legislation is is advanced out of committee.

00:38:41.440 --> 00:38:45.680
What they do is look at old legislation, the carryover.

00:38:45.680 --> 00:38:49.280
And so it's very important that we are vigilant.

00:38:49.280 --> 00:39:00.480
I'll give you an example uh there's a bill, LB31, it has to do with surveillance, student surveillance.

00:39:00.480 --> 00:39:04.560
And the bill came out of committee, it sits on general file.

00:39:04.560 --> 00:39:12.000
That could be one of those bills that could be the subject of debate early in the session.

00:39:12.000 --> 00:39:14.880
And we have concerns with the bill.

00:39:14.880 --> 00:39:23.120
The bill is meant to have very elaborate guidelines on where the data is going.

00:39:23.120 --> 00:39:35.360
The concern originally was that third-party companies may be misusing data that they they get through the surveillance systems that are installed in school.

00:39:35.360 --> 00:39:38.240
I think that's a reasonable concern.

00:39:38.240 --> 00:39:49.360
What we don't want to have happen is any kind of barrier for schools to set up surveillance cameras in the school premises.

00:39:49.360 --> 00:40:02.560
In fact, it was Senator Lineski, I remember him saying during the hearing, heck, if he says, I think parents want more surveillance because they know you know if their kids are okay and and whose kid it was that got in trouble and so on.

00:40:02.560 --> 00:40:56.120
So we will probably deal with that issue, I'm guessing, early in the session, because it's a carryover bill.

00:40:56.280 --> 00:40:56.520
Yeah.

00:40:56.520 --> 00:41:07.800
The interesting thing, you know, we've talked about on that bill is that you know just the effectiveness of security and the expectations from parents and educators, especially as a principal.

00:41:07.800 --> 00:41:09.960
How many times have you leaned on that?

00:41:09.960 --> 00:41:16.120
And if you ask it into the secondary, even the elementary, the kids know where the cameras are.

00:41:16.680 --> 00:41:27.560
And if they're gonna do bad things, they know those spots where they could do that's where I remember seeing Ronaski very smartly saying the kids know where the view is.

00:41:27.560 --> 00:41:34.440
If they want to get do something and get in trouble or not get in trouble, they go where they know the cameras aren't paying attention.

00:41:34.680 --> 00:41:48.440
Yeah, I know my building, I have a big building here at Hastings High School, so we have cameras everywhere, and except for the classrooms, except in a couple of special occasions, you know, we have pretty much in the hallways, and that's about it.

00:41:48.440 --> 00:41:53.160
But we try to hit all those blind spots as much because, like you said, kids know where they're at.

00:41:53.160 --> 00:41:56.680
They know if they don't want to get caught, they know where to hide it.

00:41:56.680 --> 00:41:59.160
I look at it from a principal standpoint.

00:41:59.160 --> 00:42:06.600
If you have it in the classroom, I look it as a safety deal where it helps keep teachers and students safe.

00:42:06.600 --> 00:42:09.400
But I also want to look at it this way.

00:42:09.400 --> 00:42:15.400
If we gave our teachers access to that camera, could they inquire about their teaching?

00:42:15.400 --> 00:42:20.520
Could they utilize that as a way to, hey, this is how I'm teaching the class?

00:42:20.520 --> 00:42:25.400
Oh, I'm noticing that I may focus my attention more on this side of the room and that side.

00:42:25.400 --> 00:42:30.280
Maybe would it would it help them inform their teaching practices to get better too?

00:42:30.280 --> 00:42:30.840
I don't know.

00:42:30.840 --> 00:42:34.120
I'm just throwing that out there because I've thought about this a lot.

00:42:34.120 --> 00:42:39.080
And I've actually had conversations with my staff from an administration standpoint.

00:42:39.080 --> 00:42:51.240
If we had a camera in every classroom, it would solve a lot of issues, a lot of hearsay, things that we have to triangulate would go away because then we could just go, let me look at the camera and we could see what actually happened.

00:42:51.240 --> 00:42:53.560
And that'd make our jobs easier, to be honest.

00:42:53.560 --> 00:42:56.760
But at the same time, I understand privacy, all that stuff.

00:42:56.760 --> 00:43:04.520
But I think I look at it this way if if the police officers could have body cams on them, why can't we just have them in all the class?

00:43:04.520 --> 00:43:05.400
That's just my take.

00:43:05.400 --> 00:44:26.520
I'm not saying it's right, wrong or indifferent but you know i think there's a a good i think it's a good thing but i also see some of the concerns about it as well yeah i was thinking of the the old song smoking in the boys' room is that well i say that because part of the concern i think is not only cameras but it's these sensors that can be installed now to vape detectors things like that and some would say well that's a violation of privacy the school would say no this is public property the rule is no smoking no vaping on school grounds so it's within the school's interest to have these detectors the cameras so what we that we could also see possibly not for sure but possibly transgender bill from Senator Kowth and I don't know exactly what that would look like but those are very emotional issues it is it is it's gonna go right back to your right back to your bathrooms in the school and you know boys using the boys and girls using the girls and uh and you know I think I think we'll see that that's one of the things she said she wants to revamp and come back on this year.

00:44:26.600 --> 00:44:27.880
So plan on that.

00:44:28.200 --> 00:44:28.760
There you go.

00:44:29.000 --> 00:44:57.080
What other bills you guys got out there that we may not hear about but might be coming up you have anything more well you know every session I it never ceases to amaze me there's always a handful of bills that are dropped that I never saw coming I never thought about and here they are we always have the surprises and and God only knows what what might be coming this year.

00:44:57.080 --> 00:46:02.120
We just know that we're gonna have to be ready to address all those issues and we will and and we are lucky because we have other public education K-12 lobbyists who work with us we have other organizations School Board Association the Teachers Association there's other groups and we work together very well and you both know having gone through the academy that collaboration is key to legislative success to advocacy you got to build a good coalition on whatever it is you're fighting for or fighting against and I believe in coalitions very much we have several that we work with right out of this building and and involves all the other alphabet soup of associations and that's very helpful because it look makes us look united and that's very important and lawmakers do see it.

00:46:02.360 --> 00:46:18.120
And that's where like that's really true and that's just a good point you make because everybody if we can keep everybody moving in the same direction and provide those opportunities to advocate and just have those conversations you know that's what's best for kids.

00:46:18.120 --> 00:46:28.840
And I that brings something to mind that it was Senator Kals really wanted to even more formally address our teacher shortage in this team.

00:46:28.840 --> 00:47:35.080
And I think you know you heard over the summer she was kind of starting to drum up some ideas but you know it sounds like maybe she has gone and met with the Department of Education here in Nebraska some other education leaders and it sounds like we may have some additional tools and resources coming out for a non-legislative solution to a real problem and I was very impressed she she wanted more tools in the toolbox about how to grow our own teachers and and and it does seem like a very attractive proposition where if a person has a four-year degree that they got five ten years ago and they're at a bank working and they you know I wish I was a teacher but I don't want to have to go in and go back to school well here's an here's an option and that is that they have all the minimum requirements but then they basically it's on the job training for a couple of years to become a teacher.

00:47:35.400 --> 00:47:47.640
The traditionalists among our group and among the teachers group probably would say no they have to do what I did and that's you go to teachers college and you you know you work your way through it.

00:47:47.640 --> 00:47:55.560
But we're not I don't think we have the luxury of saying hey let's just keep it the way it's always been we've got to think outside the box.

00:47:55.560 --> 00:48:05.160
And Senator Kal believes that and so and that's one that we'll not see in legislation because she's doing that through the state board of education.

00:48:05.560 --> 00:48:14.360
Just going back that was an opportunity where different groups collaborated and hopefully we're gonna see some action out of that that's even faster than the legislative process.

00:48:14.680 --> 00:48:42.520
Well and I I've heard about this and as a principal that's getting ready to hire some people coming up be able to have that kind of like ability to go hey this person has a degree but they have the you know they have the ability to teach this certain subject and as a principal my one of my jobs is to help teachers become better like help them with their classroom management help them with their their teaching strategies and things like that.

00:48:42.520 --> 00:49:05.160
Because even when I've brought in teachers from the transition side I'm still doing that even though they're doing the transition courses at the university either if it's at UAK or don't a built-in principal I'm still helping transition that person from the private sector into the public education side or teaching side anyway.

00:49:05.160 --> 00:49:08.280
So I'm like on we're already doing that part anyway.

00:49:08.280 --> 00:49:12.600
So I don't see the much difference if they're in a transition program or not.

00:49:12.600 --> 00:49:19.880
If you know they're somebody that can build relationships and they can help kids learn that's what we want in our public schools.

00:49:19.880 --> 00:49:49.240
And I think that's a great thing to be able to think outside the box because we can't keep doing the same thing over and over again or we're not gonna we're gonna not get the we're gonna get different we're not gonna get the different results we want we're getting the same results that we've always had and so we got to kind of keep those things going and these great ideas coming up I think that's really a great thing because I could see it being a benefit for us as principals and for teachers and trying to help with that shortage as well.

00:49:49.240 --> 00:49:51.720
So when I heard that I was kind of excited about it.

00:49:52.200 --> 00:50:24.440
Yeah yeah you know other than that uh Jeff I mean there's gonna be the unanticipated there's gonna be the anticipated some of the top topics we talked about today we we know are some are coming and then we're there's gonna always be a plate of bills that we had no idea was coming our way and now we're dealing with and and so it's hard to project exactly what those issues will be and whether they're gonna take up a lot of time or not but we'll be prepared.

00:50:24.760 --> 00:52:04.840
Mike and Tim this has been a great conversation there's been a lot of things that you know people are able to learn today in this episode and so one of the things we kind of talked about was advocacy right that's something that I'm learning to do more of as a principal so what advice would you give to administrators out there either assistant principal principal even teacher leaders even superintendents out there you know what advice would you give them to be more involved or to be more of a proactive approach when we're talking about dealing with state legislation what are some things or practical tips or things they can do to help this process so that's a good question and Jeff and and Tim having been having graduated from the academy we talk about this the fact that and it's an old adage but it it's so absolutely true and relevant all politics is local it doesn't matter if the lawmaker is a state senator or it's a US senator or governor all politics is local and that's what they relate to that's what we relate to we know best our own environment where we live what's happening and so a good advocate is going to try to pull the senator back to the impact that a certain piece of legislation would have in their locality in their school and and because that's that's how we understand things.

00:52:05.080 --> 00:53:00.840
And so a good advocate is always going to be able to tug at that senator emotionally and intellectually to say this legislation will have a positive or a negative impact and here's what's going to happen senator and you talk the you talk about exactly the impact that's what they relate to that's what they that's what hits them between the solar plexus as they say it is that's a great point that Mike made there and you know I I'll tell you that coming you know as being a former administrator especially during my superintendency what I learned very quickly was like what Mike talked about was this impact of the local impact of legislation and you know the opportunity to tell your own story this is how it's impacting our classrooms our kids our teachers our families that's what they want to hear.

00:53:00.840 --> 00:53:04.680
They don't want just a generalized approach coming back to them.

00:53:04.680 --> 00:53:21.080
You know what are the what are some of these testimonials from individuals that are out in the trenches and just you know being paying attention enough to know what bills are out there and how could and thinking through that those that's the heart of advocacy right there.

00:53:21.080 --> 00:53:46.600
And I know just from watching testimony watching debates with the Nebraska legislature I don't it's countless times where they will reach out and grab like a letter you know from an administrator or a teacher and you know read right off of it and say you know this is a district or this is a teacher or administrator in one of our my districts and this is how it affects them.

00:53:46.600 --> 00:53:49.880
So I think that's the they have to hear that personalized story.

00:53:50.280 --> 00:54:23.160
The other thing that I would say is that a reminder to all of us who advocate the people who we're we're talking to that we're trying to influence they are human beings they have feelings they can be hurt all too often I've seen where we have people who will just you know all but grab them by the collar and and shake them to say don't do this or do this.

00:54:23.160 --> 00:54:27.400
And of course that's the absolute wrong way to go about anything.

00:54:27.400 --> 00:54:29.400
That's not the right way.

00:54:29.400 --> 00:54:45.640
The best way is to talk with them as human beings and recognizing that we all can make mistakes or be wrong about something and that we can we can learn.

00:54:45.640 --> 00:54:51.880
Some senators are not willing to learn there's no point if someone come along they just don't want to hear about it.

00:54:51.880 --> 00:55:16.120
But most are willing to learn most are willing to listen if they're talked to respectfully and with dignity and not being talked down to or treated badly then yeah so we have to go back to the basics how do we want to be talked to and they're no different they want to be treated with respect and and we've got to do that.

00:55:16.120 --> 00:55:22.600
That's going to be important and so those those are at least a couple of things that I would suggest Jeff.

00:55:23.240 --> 00:55:58.360
Awesome well those are great tips guys and you know I really appreciate your guys's time today on this episode and all the things that are happening in Nebraska as well and I think a lot of this stuff will translate into other you know states as well things that we've talked about here could be applied at your local and your uh state government as well so I really appreciate your guys's time um if people would like to reach out and learn more about the Nebraska Council of School Administrators you know where could they uh connect with you guys at?

00:55:58.760 --> 00:56:37.800
So any number of means ncsa.org is our website we have a good number of members who are teachers studying to be administrators and so if there are people in that category we welcome them as student members because they'll receive everything that a that an attack or active member would receive all the news updates and publications so if it's an administrator current member of NCSA they can reach out to us anytime email text whatever and we'd be happy to help.

00:56:38.120 --> 00:56:50.200
Awesome and then what I'll do for you guys is I'll actually put that website in the show notes so it makes it easy for people to connect with you guys if they like to learn more about the NCSA organization as well.

00:56:50.360 --> 00:57:19.240
So guys hey go ahead well I was just gonna say Jeff we as you know I have a dedicated website just for legislation and uh legislative.ncsa.org and we're one of the few organizations that that have such a feature and I open that up to NCSA members they can get on and find out exactly where a bill is changes that have been made so on so it's in-depth information right at your fingertips.

00:57:19.560 --> 00:58:20.120
Awesome well I appreciate that information as well and hopefully this legislative session goes well for everybody and you guys you know keep up the great fight I appreciate all you guys do uh for the state of Nebraska and for educators as well so is there any last thing you guys like to say before we go I'll let Kim close if you have any well I I would just say kind of where we started Jeff you talked about your experience going through the advocacy academy and what a great opportunity and we've saw you know teachers principals superintendents directors ESU staffers go through this training and it's it's so valuable and it's such an eye opener as you mentioned and I think that's partially what you know led you into what you're doing and in in today's uh podcast and you know I'll just put the you know we do that the in in late June and then we turn around again in September.

00:58:20.440 --> 00:58:32.600
So there's a couple different opportunities outside the school year and during the school year where any educator can sign up and it's it's it's two days worth of just a knowledge of information.

00:58:32.760 --> 00:58:56.360
So I'd just like to you know put in the debts for we academy thank you Tim for that and it is a very intense education on advocacy and the legislative process and then the second day is a mock hearing and so I assign each person a bill and a position they don't get the choice of the position I just give it to them.

00:58:56.360 --> 00:59:31.960
I I can't remember Jeff what bill we had you on but uh you did a nice job I remember that and the idea is that you're doing the mock hearing in front of eight school administrators some retired and they will ask questions sometimes tough questions but the idea is that you have experience in a public hearing setting so that when you do make it over to the Capitol someday to testify in a real public hearing you're gonna have some experience so we hope that people would be interested in in signing up for this academy.

00:59:32.440 --> 01:00:16.200
Awesome well yeah and that's anything I could do to help spread the news about the advocacy you know workshops I will do that as well guys this has been a blast today I really just appreciate the time you guys have taken to really you know help us understand more about legislation that's coming up things you know that you know a lot of people don't maybe put a lot of thought in but I think it's a really important to put that at the forefront get people thinking about how they could be proactive you know when the state legislations are in session and how we can can help you know you know represent tell our narrative tell our stories as educators because if they if we're not out there telling our stories someone's going to tell it for us.

01:00:16.200 --> 01:00:19.000
So we got to be the ones out there doing that that work.

01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:23.640
So well Mike was great having you guys on the show I'll talk to you guys later.

01:00:24.280 --> 01:00:27.160
Yep appreciate it goodbye to you bye.

01:00:27.880 --> 01:00:35.080
As we wrap up today's episode I hope you walk away with this reminder your voice matters more than you think.

01:00:35.080 --> 01:00:42.360
State senators need educators who can ground big decisions with real stories and that comes from you.

01:00:42.360 --> 01:01:01.080
That doesn't matter if you're from the state of Nebraska or from California or Maine or Florida or Georgia or Texas or whatever state you live in your voice matters and you need to be able to share stories with your local state senators.

01:01:01.080 --> 01:01:10.360
Advocacy isn't about having all the answers it's about showing up building relationships and offering the perspective only an educator can provide.

01:01:10.360 --> 01:01:12.040
A huge thank you to Dr.

01:01:12.040 --> 01:01:13.400
Mike Dulaney and Mr.

01:01:13.400 --> 01:01:21.000
Tim Heckenlively for helping us understand what's ahead and how we can engage inform and be proactive.

01:01:21.000 --> 01:01:36.440