Novelty, Engagement, and Room Transformations with Danielle Dahlinger

What's going on everybody, I hope this finds you striving and thriving and doing absolutely amazing. Now one of the best parts about having a podcast is that you get to connect with people from all around. And these people, they're absolutely crushing it. And there are people who are passionate, who are uplifting, who make you feel inspired after you talk to them. And today, I have a conversation with one of those people. Now, before we get started, don't forget to subscribe to the podcast. So New episodes come right to you. And if you think someone would benefit from this conversation, please share. And my guest today is Danielle Dowager. She's an educator with over 20 years of experience. And she's just doing some amazing things inside a classroom. And then this conversation. Listen, as Danielle talks about the power of connecting with students. Listen, as she dives into ways that we can create engagement and anticipation inside the classroom. Listen, as she talks about room transformations, get your teeth shine, and letting go of the ego and so much more. I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. I am super excited for this episode, I have a very special guest. And sometimes I get a little bit selfish with the podcast, because it allows me to bring in people who are specific to second grade that are absolutely crushing it. And I connected with this person on Instagram. And she is phenomenal. And I went on to her story today to prep for the podcast. You know, she puts out a lot. First thing in her story. She's holding up 20 toothpicks, 20 Marshmallows, talking about engagement. And I'm engaged as watching this because I want to know what is she doing with this? This is the type of person that is with us today. She's absolutely crushing it. I want to welcome Danielle challenger to the podcast. Danielle, welcome my friend. Hi, thank you so much. I'm excited to be here and second grade will forever have my heart so we could talk about it all day long. Yeah, so I cannot wait to hear about all the gems that you're about the job. So Danielle, for the people that don't know you. Could you please give a little bit about your background? Yeah, absolutely. So I was born and raised in Southern California. My mom was a teacher her whole life. And she's actually the one that taught me that your heart has to be forward. And you have to love them first and teach them second, I watched my mom. And she dragged me along. We went to her students baseball game, we went to birthday parties. And I didn't know it at the time. But I my mom was prepping to be the teacher that I was going to be and I love her more. So I always knew I wanted to be a teacher. I ended up growing up going to school in Orange County, California, went to school to be a teacher. And then as I moved into my adult life, I started teaching at a private school right at the end of my teaching license. And that was super tough. That was not for me private school life at that age with that experience was really difficult. So I knew I was going to kind of make a transition to public school. And that was when I ended up landing at Kagan publishing and professional development. So I worked for Kagan for gosh, nine years, alongside Dr. Spencer Kagan and Laurie Kagan, and did curriculum development. My job was to build PowerPoints, write lesson plans, and support the trainers that were doing workshops all across the country. So that was really I taught our I learned everything I needed to learn about being a teacher there, which I was so thankful for. Because you know, being a brand new teacher working in a private school, like you just don't, you didn't learn a whole lot. I mean, it was all on the job training. It always is. So that was really neat, because I really got a chance to see what what research says and where research plays in the creation of instructional practices, because that's what Kagan built on. So that was an amazing opportunity for me, eventually ended up going back to the classroom. And I use everything I learned there. And it was super fantastic. In 2018, I got engaged and my husband moved me to Colorado. So I have been here ever since. I now take a dirt road to school, which is fantastic for this Southern California girl. And so I've been in second grade the whole time. I've like I've coached high school swimming and I've really worked with other teachers and other grade levels. And then I just recently got my admin Like, so I'll see kind of where that journey takes me. I'm super happy in the classroom. So I have no desire to move unless something presents itself. And then I want to go in that direction. I don't know, it's so awesome where how our journey takes us different places. And, you know, I love what you talk about, like working at Kagan, and how you learn like that research and how important like that research based practices is into the classroom. So it's actually kind of neat, because I don't know if a lot of people know Kagan story, but Dr. Spencer Kagan was actually a research psychologist. And he, that's how he started he, he wanted to know if a classroom environment that was competitive lended itself better to supporting competitive students versus cooperative. And that finally got his start. And then he eventually met Laurie Kagan and Lori brought a lot of classroom instructional practice. And they kind of just marry the two, you know, Dr. Kagan said, This is what the research says. And she said, Great, this is what it should look like in the classroom. And then poof, it was born. So it was neat to work alongside both of them to be able to understand how one drive the other actually, in, you know, you just said like competitive versus cooperative. What was his findings on that? So actually, he found that regardless of the child's predisposition of cooperative classroom was always a classroom that exceeded growth capacity, and both social and academic. And so that's how Kagan ended up producing Kagan cooperative learning structures, because that's what the research to come to and find, and help them find. Awesome. That is super cool. And I love what you talked about. When you when you said your mom, your first teacher, my mom was a teacher, too. And you said, you know, love them first? Teach them second? Because yeah, what a valuable lesson right there. And I didn't know at the time, just how critical that was going to be and how much that was going to shape me later. Because, you know, like, I was eight, I went to the same school as my mom, but it stuck with me forever. It's so neat, because sometimes, you know, when I was first starting out, and you know, a little over 20 years ago, sometimes in the advice back then was, you know, don't smile until after Thanksgiving. Right? Can't put the toothpaste back in the tube once you've let it out. Yes, yes. And you but now, you know, when when you know better you do better? And that relationship piece? It's all about that relationship? Yeah, definitely. I was very thankful to be able to have that. And then, you know, in my journey in my career I had, and this is terrible to say, but it's also very real. You know, I had a lot of examples of like, what terrible teachers look like as a student, and then what you see. And that developed you to like, the irony is my second grade teacher, I felt constantly that he hated me. And I knew that I never wanted a kiddo in my class to ever feel like that. And so that drove me to Yeah, absolutely. Sometimes, you know, is looking at the teachers that were phenomenal, and what they did for us, but also looking at, like, you know, those teachers that you had a bad experience with, and making sure that we're not that going forward? Absolutely. That emotion drives you as well as all the good stuff. Absolutely. So I lead with 20 toothpicks, 20 marshmallows on lunch bag, can you break that down for everybody? Because I just thought I was watching it. I was like, oh, I want to see what she's doing? Absolutely. If you've spent any time on my Instagram, and anybody who goes to visit, you'll know that if I can bring food to the table done, is there. Anything food related? It's that engagement piece, you know, is different. We don't do food all the time. But if I can. So today, we took two sets of marshmallows, and we created 3d shapes. We just came from 2d, 2d shapes. And so the kids had a chance to just kind of explore how would you turn this into this? And what would it look like? And what is the marshmallow represent? You know, the vertices and what did the toothpicks represent? And it was really just kind of exploration that really kind of took my lesson exactly where I needed it to go. And it landed exactly where we needed it to land and they got to eat the marshmallows. And so I won, and so did they absolutely can never go wrong with food, especially second grade, you bring food to the table and the kids are all in. But what I also loved about it is that you talked about in your story was it wasn't like you just handed it out. You know, it's time for math class. You know, here's 20 Marshmallows. Here's 22 pics, you talked about like it's morning meeting or your morning message time. Yeah, so it kind of goes back to when we're talking about engagement. Brain research tells us just how important that balance between novelty and routine is. You know, the kids where it's the same old everyday, everyday everyday, they'll get more they will, especially ones that have Hard time attuning they'll check out even faster. And so I really try to be conscious of, we're very structured, we have a routine. But if you just throw something different in there, the kids, it tunes their brain like, Oh, this is, this is different, even though I know what my morning meeting is, I know what my job is. I know I have to read the board. But this time the board says to go get marshmallows and toothpicks. And this is awesome. And so I really try hard. Because when you have engagement, like yeah, you have the big engagement, the big lessons, the big to dues, but really, when you're talking about engagement, there's these day to day things that are really important. It's the daily things you do to get the kids engaged. And I think that novelty versus routine is a part of that is essential. And I don't know that we always talk about the daily thing. Yeah, 100%. Because routine, it does, like even our best students, the ones that are the most dialed in, they get bored with the routine. Yeah, I love how you made them sit with that all day long to earn until math class started. So they're sitting there, there's that bag with the marshmallows and the toothpicks. And they're just, they have to think about it. You know, what are we going to do with this and everything. And it was funny because you listen to them talk about it. And we could do this. And we could do that. And it was funny, because I overheard two of my kids, and one of them said, Do you think she'll let us eat the marshmallows and the other kiddos said, she always does, we just have to be good. So it was so cute to hear that like we kind of have a soft start in the morning. So that's that opportunity to kind of like drum up that excitement and listening to the kids because I always try to hear nuggets. And it's, it's cute, because it's like it's working. And it's fun. And they're invested. Yes. And you know, what I found too, is because the day can get stressful, and you can get burned out. So hearing those little, little nuggets that the day dropped those cute little things that can give you just that quick little shout of joy. Yeah, you need and you can laugh about when you go home at the end of the day, and no seven and eight year olds. I mean, they are all the motivation, whether they realize it or not the things that they do, or they say, and the little mini me that you hear out in the classroom throughout the day. I mean, it is a genuine burst of joy and motivation to get you through at all. Absolutely. Now what are some other things because I know you I watched your Instagram, and I see all the different things that you're doing inside the classroom. So what are some of the things that you do like to spark that engagement, that curiosity? So I think it really goes back to, you know, strategically and intentionally putting exploration into your lesson plan. I think we're always I think we have a tendency sometimes to get driven with. This is my lesson. This is my lesson plan design. This is what it's going to look like this is how guided practice exit ticket, all of all the words. But I think that there's so much room for exploration, that if you kind of let go of that, and that's hard that control piece that keep us on schedule. But I think as much as we have a balance between novelty and routine, I think having a balance between practice and exploration is equally as important. Because I think it's fantastic when you just watch kids explore the conversations that come from that the unsuspecting kids that connect and talk and what a disservice would it be for us not to be able to factor that into our day as well. Yeah. So I love that, you know that exploration versus like that strict practice and mixing it up and giving them that freedom from time to time. So good. Now, you also do some like room transformations and everything. Yeah. So those engagement strategies, those are the ones that we look at that are like more elaborate and kind of take some long term planning. Because when we look at engagement, I think it's important to look at like, okay, what are my day to day Saturdays, but what are my like big pillars, that'll get me throughout the year. And in 2020, I stumbled across get your teach on. And they were absolute lifesavers when we were all going through COVID. And one of the books I read was The wildcards. And it talks about the power of room transformation. And so we kind of as a staff in our building, took some steps to kind of dive into that. What does that look like? How do we figure that out? And so room transformations quickly kind of became a staple in our building, and in my classroom for certain things, and every year is different. So it really depends for me, it depends on the kids, I tried to build it around what they're into. So at the beginning of this year, Pokemon cards were it like, they were great about keeping them away during class time, but during recess, they would try to teach me all the things I'm not gonna lie, I have no idea what they're about. But I built a room transformation around Pokeyman. And, I mean, they couldn't have been more excited, they captured cards, they had to do this, they had to do that. And the type of content that they were chewing on and working on. And processing was so much harder than if I had just done a normal day. And so I do I like those transformations, when we have something that's really hard and maybe really boring to teach is like a normal lesson to really kind of dial up that engagement so that they can have that time to chunk into but in something that's like very high interest. Awesome. How do you break down the room transformation? So my kids, you know, my little ones just had Pokeyman on their desk this morning. So I know all about the Pokeyman craze. I'm thinking right now, like, do you make that just like for a single subject do how do you do it? You do it for the whole day? What? What's up? What's it look like? So I tried to make the best of the best bang for my buck, if I'm going to invest all the time, energy, we're doing all the things. So for room transformation, I kind of start with what is some content I have, that's going to be tough. And I kind of build it around that. So I build it around the tough content, what's something that might be a little dry, maybe hard, and I build it around that. But then I also kind of SEEP it out into the day where other things that we're doing maybe are just for practice. So punk Pokeyman was a full day event. And the meat of it was around our literacy concepts. But then we also did things for math that were just practice so that they could have fluency in the math content that we were doing in that time of the year. So it went like a whole day. And I always do a lead up into it. So there'll be I'll either make a video the day before, or the kids will get like an invitation to come dressed as a certain things. Or I've even gone so far as to drop things off at kids house, like at the end of the day, after school, I'll go drop bags off at their house. So anything to just really kind of build it up to be a really big, exciting thing. And then they come into school that day, and they're just in it to win it for the whole day. That's awesome. Now, how often do you do room transformation. So it has actually fluctuated, we used to do quite a bit of them. And now I'm a little bit more selective what we do, I think, I think we can get really excited to do something over and over and in our building, because we have several teachers that do that. We don't want the novelty to wear off right in that, you know, so if you're doing K through three, and like you've done room transformations every month for the last kindergarten, first grade, you get to second grade, and it kind of lost its luster. So we've tried to as a team kind of be intentional about how often we're doing them and which ones we do so that we could do that. So it ends up being we do room transformations, two, maybe three times a year max. But we've also incorporated some other things building wide that aren't like we did a market day for economics, where we did K through three, and we did an entire market day. So we've tried to kind of do think room transformation adjacent for that engagement. Yeah, what would that market day look like? I'm intrigued, so you got that the whole building K to three, right? So we have our whole downstairs, K through three, first, second. And third all do a good bit of goods and services when it comes to their standard on economics. So we decided that first grade in third grade would create products, good. And second grade would be in charge of services. So leading up to market day, there's so much that goes into this. I mean, this is a unit that spans months. So leading up to market day, we knew we all had to teach money, points, counting. So my kids had to do that. And then my kids got employed, I hired them to be my employees, and they earned money for marketing, right. And they had to keep track of it, they had to know how much they had, they had to exchange coins, they had to do all the things. And then because we were in charge of goods and services, my kids were divided into groups, and they had to come up with a business plan as an entrepreneur, what services you're gonna provide to first and third graders on market day. And so it was really neat, because they had to come together as groups, they had to submit a business plan, they had to submit supply lists, their business plan had to be approved, they had to have a certificate of permit, they had to have a permit. And then on market day, we all rotated kids going to the different classrooms, and the kids could use the money that they earned to buy goods in first or third grade. Or they could use the money to come experience a service in second grade. Oh, that's such a good like a whole school like K through or one through three experience right there. So it was neat, because scarcity is a big standard in second grade. And so as the kids are running their business, they had supplies, but I purposely withheld quite a bit of the supplies. So that once they experienced scarcity as a business, they had to decide, are we going to pay money for the supply? Are we going to pay that much money and so just the conversation and the negotiation of what came into it was so much easier than just reading a book about scarcity or talking about different services. And so things like that will sit with the kids forever. Versus anything they do paper and pencil and so room transformations or things like that are what we create for those, those engagement strategies that kind of hit home. Yeah, that's so good. And I just love like when you talk about nine then I can just hear as you're talking about it, like the number one then foodgasm the engagement, the vocabulary, the real life experience that you're giving him just so good. That's why I bring you on. So I can pick your brain about this stuff. Well, it's important. You know, when we're talking about kids learning in school, what we're really talking about is building knowledge. And what better knowledge to build about the way our world works in the world that they will soon be in figuring out what does that look, what does that look like. And if we can lay that foundation and kindergarten first and second, and then build from it, then they'll have the knowledge that they need, as they go into high school or adult. Absolutely, and it's just gonna, it's gonna stay with them, you know, that experience, just like the build up the excitement for it. So good. It's neat. It's neat. I'm really proud. And it's a lot of fun, and the kids learn a lot. Awesome, awesome. Awesome. Now I know that you're really big on relationships, too. Do you have anything that you really like to do that kind of sparks or helps you connect with the kids. So our building has a soft start. And what I've really come to love is I just play with the kids. Because I'm learning men's and they can play, they can build, they can do things. And as a teacher, it's so easy to just put on a timer and say, Okay, I have to get this ready, I have to get this ready. Okay, this is an extra This is next and just kind of live in our worlds, but I just play with your kids, sit and play with them and beat them. It's okay, if you went into No, it's okay. And play with them and laugh and joke and have fun or teach them chess or teach them that. And I feel like those are where the relationships are built the most. Because you learn a ton about the kids, their strengths that you might not see as an in an academic setting, what they're good at what they're interested in how they support people. And I think that's the root of a lot of relationships is just that, that time where it's unexpected that you're gonna bond. Absolutely. And I love how you talked about right there, like you can see certain things in kids. So we all have kids that are academically like they're just crushing it. And they get a lot of praise and stuff. But there's others that struggle with different academic pieces, but they have their own strengths and their own gifts. And they need to be reminded of that. And that gives you a chance to see that. And it gives you a chance to highlight that form as well. Like, there's not a lot of eight year olds that know how to play chess, but I have tested in the classroom and finding those kids that can play chess. That's an unsuspecting talent that you discover. And then watching those kids teach the other kids how to play tests. Unless you make space for that, and like watch them and let them step into that you miss it. And what a terrible thing to miss. Absolutely. Now for the soft start. How does that work when you roll that out? So our school day starts at 7:30am very early, and our doors open at 715. So we also provide breakfast. So pretty much from 715 to like 745 it's considered our soft start, kids come in, they can eat breakfast, they can get ready for the day. So there are some kids, I have that right, right at 715. They're out the door. So for 30 minutes, there's a lot of opportunities to just hang out and talk. So for me, as a teacher, I make sure that I am 100% Ready for my day by 715. So that I've opened up a space to be able to just kind of receive whatever, that moment or those times get to give me Yeah, and that's so good. And then that gives you a good way to start the day. Just get a few laughs and have a little bit of conversation with the students and everything. It's been it's a really valuable time that I'm, I'm thankful that I that I recognize it because I think we're teaching it so easy to just get to our list. You know, so many things that we do the papers to turn in the things to agree that this the that that being able to just take a step back and recognize that this space is needs to be protected is super important, I think is a valuable use of time. Yeah. 100% 100%. Now one thing that I like to is when I'm watching you on Instagram is you bring a lot of humor into to that now is that natural to bring humor into your day. And everything is it is and it's funny because the hardest part of second grade is the first like four months where nobody gets sarcasm in the class. But then as they start to kind of open up and develop a little bit we do I mean, I think I like to use sarcasm, I like to throw myself under the bus. I like to highlight mistakes. I like to laugh at myself. And that just opens the door for the kids to do it. You've never heard anyone critique someone's writing like you hear my class, critique my writing up on the board. And I think again, I think that goes back to relationships. Like I can laugh at myself. I can laugh at you. We can fees, we can talk about things and it just creates safety. Yes. 100%. And yeah, the students absolutely love when they get to pick apart or do a little critique of everything that we've done? That's for sure. Absolutely. I'm like, why don't you read your writing as clear and as detailed as you're analyzing where I put the.on My eyes, but thank you. Absolutely. And I think you said some pretty special things there too, though, like when when you talk about being there for your students and showing them like you can laugh at yourself, I think that's a big thing. I think being there and just know, creating those connections, where you find those little things in throughout the school day where you can laugh at, and you can grow as a classroom community is much needed as well. And I also think, as a teacher, if you can, like, son, that gut belly laugh at something your kids do, like, that makes them feel good, too. I mean, these kids are developing personality, they're figuring out their place in the world, you know, they're testing lines are testing boundaries, they're kind of forming themselves. And, you know, just honoring that sense of humor on both sides of things like yes, that is funny or, or understanding that, like, there's a boundary and things like that, but doing that in the form of honoring their development, I think it's also part of the day that you can't schedule it, and you can't plan in. Yeah, and what and when we're talking about classroom culture, to just show a classroom, that's having a good time that's laughing together, that, you know, you're gonna see a classroom that is thriving. I agree, I think, you know, taking that time is taking that one step back is definitely going to give you 234 steps forward, it's that kind of go political fast, you know, taking a moment for this is going to pay dividends when it comes to wanting their attention, wanting them to take risks, you know, taking that superhard academic content and really chewing on it, because I think they're in an environment and the safety that they need there exists. And they can do that. Yes, 100% 100%. Now, you're big. And what I've loved and that I've seen you do is you share a lot about what you're learning, you know, you embrace that lifelong learner. So can you share, like, what are some things that you've been learning about this year that really stood out to this year, I read a book called The knowledge gap by Natalie waxer. And it there was lots of confirming moments like, Yes, I knew that, yes, I believe that. But then there were lots of other things where I just kind of sat there and stared and, and chewed on things. It took me a while it took me a lot longer to get through the book than I thought it was because there were lots of things where I really had to take my ego out of the conversation in my own head. And And honestly, Is this me? Or is this not? Can I do better? Is there space to take this into what I need. And it's the irony, and that is one thing that I kind of took away from that that book is it starts with a historical perspective on literacy, and from the 70s 80s and 90s how we got here. So and one of the threads that I saw in that is is just how powerful a teacher's ego can be in holding things back. And I think that that's something to really think about it for any of us. And so being a lifelong learner, it does mean the things that I think are tried and true, like, it's not going to hurt anybody to set them aside and try something. Yes. And so being that learner and reading and engaging and following people and taking what they say and trying it, I think it's important, because at the end of the day, I'm just trying to be better than I was yesterday. 100% 100% and I love how you talked about like the ego, that our ego can hold us back. And like you said, we might, you know, we've been both around the game for for 2020 getting around that years, we'll go Adesh 20 ish. And so we can get set in our ways. And we can think because we've always done it this way. That's the best practice. But sometimes, you know, we do need to step back reevaluate look at what some people that are really diving into that research are doing and and ask ourselves, are we could we do it a little bit differently? Could it be a little bit better? I think for teachers instructional practice starts to become synonymous with comfortable and becoming uncomfortable. Nobody wants to be uncomfortable for sure. But don't we don't we have an obligation to be uncomfortable when it comes to like the kids features? I mean, because when you're a literacy teacher, that's what we're talking about, right? All the research says K through three if they are have any deficits. By the time they get to third grade, the chances of them overcoming those differences are very small. And so as a K through three teacher you're looking at literally holding children's future in your hands. Because we live in an information age, if they can't read, like, what are they going to do? Right? And so when you look at it like that our ego has no place in that. If I can know better and do better than open that door and get me there. Yeah, and I think there's a big shift in the world with like, the science of reading. And it's definitely gaining more and more momentum, and everything, which is amazing, because that research has been around for so long. And that's what I mean by that research has been around for, you know, tons decades. And it's the teachers ego that say, Well, yeah, that's not gonna work. Because this and it's like, that, doesn't it? Yes, yes. And, you know, I like what you talked about, like, becoming uncomfortable. Because we've been teaching, you've been teaching for a long time, you know, like, if you've done something a certain way, you're very comfortable with it, that the first time you do something, it's never like a well oiled machine. It may not go as smooth as what you did previous. But like you said, I mean, we really got to step back when we look at the statistics that they're saying in the literacy world. Absolutely. Yeah. Maybe we need to change up the way that we do certain things. Absolutely. I agree. I think it is important to change and grow. I mean, the world is changing and growing, and what things happening are changing and growing. So how is it that we're not changing and growing to be able to adapt kids for that growth? Like it boggles my mind where people want to stay? Because we just can't, like, we don't even have a choice life moving. We need to pass? Yes, it is crazy how fast life is moving. Um, you know, one thing that that makes me I guess, uncomfortable, because I just cheer about it. But it'll be interesting to see, like the chat GPT. Yeah, like, and maybe it won't affect us as much, I'm sure it'll trickle down, and we'll be able to use it and implement it. But like, the, the educators that the higher grades, and how that's gonna affect how they approach everything. But you can always it's how we view things too, because I can take it through a lens like this is awful. Or take it through a lens where you see the possibilities that are there, too. Yeah, yeah. And I think I think it's a mistake for us to ever try to fight against technology. Because if we're being honest, I mean, look at where we are, I mean, we hold the entire world knowledge in our phone. And we couldn't do that, how many years ago. And so I think when you look at things that are coming out, you know, leaning into it, granted with fear, and with uncomfort, and not knowing what to do and all the skepticism, absolutely, but but still lean in with all that skepticism. Because at the end of the day, that is what our kids are going to be navigating and looking at and doing and talking about, for us to just hold them back. Because we're holding ourselves back out of fear. It makes zero sense to me. Yeah. And it's, it's amazing. And I always go back to this story. Like when you talk about technology, and you're so true. It's not going anywhere. You know, it's only going to keep steamroll. And especially like, think about when we were 20, some years old, the technology, the old flip phone or rotary phones attached to the wall. Absolutely, yes. And but it's only going to keep going and we can embrace it. Like more than we give ourselves credit. I always go back like, you know, COVID hit. A couple of ladies loved them. And they just retired last year. So they were in like, early 60s. They don't know what in the world Zoom is all about. But they were forced. And they talked about it like the principal, who was their student teacher at one point, but now it'd become their principal had to come over and sit with them at their kitchen table, and walk them through how to do zoom and how to do all of that. And they said, you know, in that moment, like there, they were crying in that, but they fought through it. And they got better at it. And they just, I was so proud of them for pushing through that uncomfortableness and that they knew what they were doing to it. Yeah, they're leaning in. We're, our capacity is is so much more plastic than we give ourselves credit for our brain has an unbelievable amount of plasticity in terms of what we can grow and unlearn and learn and grow and retrain. And even as adults, our brain is still has a tremendous amount of plasticity, no matter what we think. And I think we have to understand that like we can do a lot of things. We can do hard things, we can do difficult things. We can do things so far outside our comfort zone, because I think at the end of the day, our kids need that from us. We don't Know what job that we're preparing the kids for. But if we can prepare them to be good people, if we can prepare them to communicate, you know, all those other social emotional pillars that the kids need to be able to walk away with, on top of academics, ya know that those those skills right, there are so key, you know, those key skills well, awesome, my friend. Now two of my favorite questions that I always ask people is because I always love to hear what everybody's doing out there is a reading I should say or listening to is any book recommendations or podcasts recommended recommendations that you have. So in terms of podcasts, I'm pretty narrow in my podcast listening. So I listen obviously to you, because just as the rainbows and sparkles of sunshine that sits on my, on my mind as I listened in to your positivity and the people that you choose and bring absolutely fantastic, Melissa and Laurie love literacy. That's a podcast I love to listen to what I really love about that podcast is they bring a ton of professionals that come in people that wrote the Common Core standards, people that looked actually looked at the research that knows what it says. So I like those primary sources like from the horse's mouth kind of triple our teaching is also really great, especially when they have podcast on phonics. I always listen to that because I think we're never going to learn enough about phonics instruction. And then even though it's not pod, podcast, necessarily get your teeth on puts out a ton of information via Instagram or webinars. And just the vibe and how they honor teachers, I think is something that we can all lean into it because this job is hard. And there are times where we questioned feeling valued and get your T 10. does a really great job to honor the difficulty with still highlighting the value of people. Yeah, you know what, I get your T shirt on? I've seen them could you for the people who aren't familiar with like hoping Wei Qing? Could you give them like a little like what that experience was was like going to get your teach me that? Yeah, so I'm hoping we were both teachers. That's how it started. They started as teachers, and they wanted to do something for teachers. And so over, you know, many years get your teeth on was born. And if you were to go to the National Conference, if you ever have the time, it is such an entire vibe, when it comes to how to honor teachers, it's, it's honoring them in the space that they hold. So when I say that it means you're not just a teacher, yes, academics are important. Yes, we can help you with resources. But the fact that this job is hard, the fact that anxiety and depression and all those things play a factor. The people that that do that are in education, they honor them, they see them, they value them, and they lift them up. And I think it's it's such a unique experience to have professional development as an educator, but also professional development as a human together in one area. Because you don't often get that you don't often get acknowledged that this is hard. And you're trying to be a teacher and a mom and a parent and a dad and this and that. And I think for them to take space to honor both sides of those equally is something that I think all teachers need to hear. Yeah, it looks fantastic. And it sounds fantastic. It's awesome. Awesome. And I know that your dive into some books as well. Do you have any book recommendation? Yeah. So um, the wildcard that I mentioned earlier, was hoping Wade King Day read that. And the whole premise of that is, you never know what you are to a kid in that moment. You could be that wildcard for that kid that changes the entire trajectory. And I think that that's something that we do have to spend everyday remembering that we have a place. Yes. Also, I read unpacked your impact by Louisa pAB. And Naomi O'Brien, and what I loved about that, as they put Social Studies at the forefront of education, as knowledge building. Super great read, super great read. I mentioned the knowledge gap. Natalie waxer. I think Wexler, I think that's really important in terms of just if you're an educator, understanding the historical perspective of literacy, I think is a really important thing. And then building authenticity. I just read that as a leader. And it's written by a few principles, which I absolutely love. But I think it's also just great as a human to make space for that like authentic view of yourself, the space that you're in, who you're leading, no matter what the position you have in the world is. And so those are books that I think over the last over the course of the last three to four years have really shaped me as an educator. Ya know, there's some fantastic recommendations right there, Danielle, thank you. Now if someone wanted to get in touch with you, or can Yeah, what's the best way that they can connect. So Instagrams The best way is coffee cups and lesson plans on Instagram, I usually put a ton out there, I love to connect, I love to talk, I love to nerd out with all things second grade literacy, school teaching. It's really something that brings me a lot of passion. And I think it's important to have those safe spaces out there. And so that would definitely be the best way. Yeah, absolutely. And I suggest everybody connect with you. Because, um, you know, like I said, earlier, we touched upon a little bit like, number one, you you share a great PD. But you also, you know, when I said that, that humor piece, you put out some and I don't know, if you realize how, how funny I find myself chocolate, when I look at some of the stuff that you put out there. It's in that I think that laughter in your day, and the stuff that happens at school that you can sit there and you can laugh about it's, it's important, and it's done in a positive, like not putting down certain things. It's just kind of, you know, making light of certain things that we deal with. So I have to have that balance. Yes. So please check out Danielle, I'll leave all your information in the show notes. Now, if you could have the listener walk away with one thing? What would that be? Gosh, I just think our jobs are hard. Absolutely. But there's so much joy to be had. And if I could leave anybody anything, don't let the white noise of our job hijack the joy that everyday bring. Yes, I think that is so important. I think that is so important. Like, don't let that noise because there's joy. There's a lot of joy there. And it's, but it can get lost if we're not intentional about seeing as beautiful Danielle. So yeah, well, I want to thank you, this has been such a blessing. You are amazing. My friend. I say oh, man, this has been so much fun. Yeah, it's a you do so many good things so much great PD, and you have been just such amazing energy. So thank you so much, you so much. I'm glad we connected. And I hope everything goes really well for you for the rest of the year. Yes, you too, my friend. This was such an awesome conversation. Danielle, she's just doing some amazing things. And she dropped gem after gem in this conversation. Now this is the teaching tamping state where I share three of my favorite takeaways. And the first gem that I loved was when Danielle talked about learning from the good and the bad. And she talked about when she was younger than unfortunately, she had some negative experiences with some of her teachers. But she learned from that. And she vowed never to be like that to her students. And I think this is something that's truly impactful that we need to reflect on our own experiences with the teachers that we've had. And really think about what were the good things that some of our teachers did? And, unfortunately, what were some of the negatives? What were some of the things that didn't create the best learning experience for us? And we can learn from both of these from the positives? How can we implement that into our own teaching? And for the negatives? How can we be sure, and be aware that we don't do that to our own students? And I think it's also important that we observe those around us, because there's so many people that are doing amazing things. So just look in your own hallway at school. Notice the great things that your colleagues are doing? And how can we learn from that? How can we incorporate some of what they do into our own daily practices. Now, the second gem that I loved, was all about building novelty into our daily routine. And just as we talked about in this conversation, a few toothpicks and marshmallows, a lunch bag that can pique curiosity, it can build excitement, it can create anticipation, just with those simple things. So think about what are the little things that we can do on a daily basis to create a little extra spark. The third gem that I loved was how Danielle talked all about the ego. How when we hold on too tight to the thought that this is the way I've always done things. It can be a true detriment to our students. It can be a true detriment to our own growth. So sometimes we have to put that ego aside and ask it is what we're doing the most effective thing? Is there something that I should be doing differently. And it's all about understanding that when we try something new, it might not be as smooth as we would like it to be. And that's all right. We try something, we reflect, we make adjustments, and then we do it all over again. Because in order to grow, we must push the ego to the side. Now these were just a few of my favorite gems. Hit me up on Twitter at be Martin real or Instagram at teaching champions podcast, and let me know what were some of your favorite takeaways from this conversation? A big thank you to Danielle for dropping so many gems, make sure you follow her on Instagram as she shares out daily content. And also thank you to all of you for being here for being part of the teaching champions community. We support we encourage we lift each other up. And always remember, it doesn't matter if you're from rural America, to urban America, to Canada, to Spain to Bahrain. We're all on that same team. We're all on that same mission. And we're always better together. Keep being amazing, my friends, and as you go out into the week, May you step into your strength may step into your shine, and let's build our champions. Have a great week, everybody