Episode 71 | HOPE-Fueled Leadership: How to Thrive Without Sacrificing Yourself with Carman Murray

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Welcome to the Lead with Hope
podcast, where we explore the

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power of habits, optimism,
mindset, purpose, and excellence

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in leadership and in life.
And today I'm talking to Carmen

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Murray.
Carmen, why don't we just get

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started with you, telling the
listeners a little bit about

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your background, your story,
Tell them about you.

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Absolutely.
Thank you for having me, Brandy.

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It's so great to be here.
So a little bit about me.

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I live in Alberta, Canada.
It's north of Calgary a little

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bit.
And I spent years in a

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classroom, 15 of them.
And I absolutely loved it until

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the moment I didn't.
And I promised myself that I

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wasn't going to do things I
didn't like to do.

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And so there became a moment
where the West seed was planted

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of, oh, do I want to do this
anymore?

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And that seed, like most seeds,
took sprout.

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And I began to question things.
And then my health kind of took

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a little bit of a dive and I
stepped out of education.

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I stepped out of the classroom
knowing that I would never go

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back.
Yeah.

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And it, yeah, it's so powerful
to to kind of have these

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conversations in our heads when
maybe the conversations in our

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heads aren't that healthy and
really understand that there's

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something deeper going on that
needs some deep healing.

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And that part for me was like a
big eye opener for me.

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I've done alternative healing
for the past 20 years.

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And it was like, oh, there's
more that needs to be taken care

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of.
I need to do, I need to be

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looking after myself
differently.

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And that led me into doing
professional development for

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teachers.
And one of my favorite places to

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be is in a room full of teachers
having conversations about where

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they're at and what they're up
to and their challenges and how

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simple mind shifts for
themselves.

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And small tweaks in their
classrooms can really shift

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their mindset and help their
students as well as them in a

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profession that sometimes can be
siloed and is so

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all-encompassing.
Yeah, Carmen, we have so much in

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common.
So much in common.

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I started out as a school social
worker and then got into

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leadership.
And after 25 years, my journey

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sounds very similar to yours.
I got to the point where I

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wasn't finding any joy in this
journey anymore and my health

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started to take a dive.
It started to take a toll.

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And you know, my mom died of
cancer at the age of 44.

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And I believe in large part her
health journey declined so

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rapidly due to the impact of
stress on her life and, and her

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mindset.
Because once she got that

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diagnosis, she lost hope.
Yeah.

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So, you know, my focus is on
Wellness, resilience, this

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mental health issue with with
our leaders.

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And I do believe everything
rises and falls on leadership.

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But when you think about the
teachers in our schools, our

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teachers are boots on the ground
leaders in the classroom.

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And also there's a lot of
teacher leaders out there that

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are carrying a lot of weight
each and every day.

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So thinking back on your
journey, Carmen, what

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experiences or lessons have had
the biggest impact on you that

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you now have brought into your
work with professional

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development?
One of the biggest lessons for

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me was not going it alone, like
thinking I had to do it by

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myself and that it was a badge
of honor, a badge of strength.

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But if I could do it by myself,
that then you know what people

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could see that I was strong and
that I could do things.

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And I believe that came from an
upbringing, but also as well as,

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you know, just the teacher
profession and, and, and just,

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you know, getting ourselves out
there and doing the things that

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need to be done.
And what I've learned is just

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because I can't do it or just
because I can't do it myself,

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excuse me, doesn't mean I have
to.

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And that it's for me, it's so
much more fun to do it with

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someone else.
It's like, can I have a

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conversation and can we generate
ideas together as opposed to

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sitting in my basement doing it
by myself struggling through.

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It's like, oh, I can connect
with someone.

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We can bring our ideas together.
And for me, that sparks a joy.

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And also you talk about hope and
I, I love your acronym Hope.

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And what it does for me is it
builds this hope that there are

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other people out there doing
what we do.

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And when we bring our minds
together, it's so powerful.

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That ripple effect that shows up
just by the conversation that

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you and I are having and the
listeners that are listening.

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There might be something that we
say that sparks hope for them

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and changes the trajectory just
a little bit.

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Yeah.
Or for some other people, it

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might be a lot, but there's like
those tiny shifts that happen

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that we don't even sometimes
recognize and they're.

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Huge, absolutely.
And you know, you talk about

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mindset and you know that my
acronym, you know, optimistic

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outlook, that's mindset.
That's what I'm talking about.

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And it all starts in the mind
because when we think about our

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thoughts, our thoughts influence
everything else that we do.

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And you know, scripture tells us
take captive your thoughts and

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we're wired just the way we were
created and the way we were

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wired.
There's this negativity bias and

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a lot of our thoughts tend to go
negative because we we can get

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stuck in that fear mode, what I
call fear mode, as opposed to

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hope or love mode.
And in fear mode, it's

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ruminating on those negative
thoughts.

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It's focusing on the fears and
and allowing them to limit us in

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becoming the best version of
ourselves, which, as you so

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aptly put Carmen, requires human
connection.

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And I also like, I, I want to
say that mind piece, when we

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have those negative thoughts in
our mind or those thoughts that

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aren't great, they are reflected
in our physical body.

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Like that's the other thing too,
that is so important is when

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we're stressed up here, there's
all this stuff going on in your

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body.
And, and you talked about your

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mom in that when we lose hope
and we live in that fear,

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there's a direct reflection that
happens in our physical body,

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which then can sometimes hinder
us from taking those action

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steps, like collaborating with
others or connecting with a

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teacher down the hallway or
taking a day off so that we can

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bring ourselves back so we have
that hope again and go, Oh yes,

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I can do this and I don't have
to do it alone.

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Yeah, yeah, those limiting
thoughts and and I think the

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most powerful tool that I have
and that I share with leaders

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and and the people that I work
with in my work now is just

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reframing that, you know that
that simple reframe.

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So, you know, do an exercise
like a thought journal and

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record even for seven days,
record your thoughts and look at

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the patterns of your thoughts.
You know, are you

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catastrophizing?
Are you engaging in black and

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white thinking?
How can you take those thoughts

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captive and reframe them instead
of I have to, I get to right?

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It's, it's simple shifts like
that that really make all the

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difference.
And if you look at statistics in

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our world today, the mental
health statistics are

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staggering.
There are so many anxious and

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depressed people in our world
and coming up on the holidays

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and the holidays spark a lot of
angst and uncertainty and, and

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depression in a lot of people.
So tell me, based on on what you

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know, based on your work, what
ways would you recommend that

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leaders, specifically leaders in
our schools and our districts,

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how can they foster a workplace
culture that prioritizes mental

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health and well-being?
And why should they do that?

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What are the key benefits for
that?

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When I read that question, I got
all excited in in your questions

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when I was prepping for the
interview.

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I'm like, Oh yes, like those,
those moments and those things

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that that seem so huge and can
be so small.

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Like when I run my workshops
with educators in the room, we

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always start with 10 breaths.
We just pause and we take 10

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breaths together.
And one of the things I invite

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educators to do is every time
you start a class, like if you

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teach high school, sometimes you
only get the kids for chunks of

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the day.
It's like, can you pause and

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give those kids a minute to take
10 breaths when they before they

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leave their classroom and in the
cities go into a hallway of 1000

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other kids?
Can you give them those that

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minutes to do 10 breaths where
they're calming their nervous

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system?
They, they know they can walk

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out in the hall now and it's not
going to just like be somebody's

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poking at them and, and they
can't control themselves with

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that anxiety you talked about.
I think it's so important for

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educators to be doing in our
classrooms because educators are

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with kids, you know, 6 to 8
hours a day, depending on where

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you go to school and all of the
things.

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And can we give them those touch
points where they can pause and

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teach them a tool that they can
use?

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Like kids can do 10 breaths
anytime.

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The other one that I feel really
is really important.

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And I believe I heard you talk
about this on one of your other

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podcasts with one of your other
guests.

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Is this pause and reflect?
Can we give kids students

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ourselves as educators and
leaders?

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Because we're modeling, right?
We're modeling what we want kids

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to do.
Can we give them time to just

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sit and pause and reflect on
what just happened?

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And it's interesting because
when I think about kids and when

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I taught in the classroom, it's
more likely that we're having a

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kid reflect on what they did
wrong.

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When an incident has happened,
it's like, can we give them a

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moment to reflect on their
morning?

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What went well?
What are you grateful for?

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Who helped you out?
And those kind of moments so

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they can slow their nervous
system down, realize what their

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gratitude, have gratitude for
and take that moment to be in

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that gratitude before they
continue.

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And also reframing things.
It's like, oh, if this is how my

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morning went, how do I want my
afternoon to look or things like

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that where they can take, they
can look back and look at their

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regrets, not as negative things
that are like weighing them

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down, but look at their regrets
and go, oh, I want to change

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that for this afternoon.
I think those are those are

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powerful things that can be done
in classrooms.

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And it feels like sometimes it
feels like teachers have so much

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to do and I totally want to
honor all that they do.

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And it's like, can you still
give those moments of pause and

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reflect for yourself and the
students?

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Because I think that's really
important that teachers take

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that time with students as
opposed to it being something

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that they have to do at recess
or when they're wolfing down

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their lunch or whatever that is.
Can you pause and take 10

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breaths with those kids and let
your nervous system calm down?

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Yeah.
And in preparation for this

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recording today, I listened to
your podcast episode with Sam

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Demma.
Sam, it's amazing.

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Yes, I love him too.
And I was excited when I saw

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that you had been on his show
because I too, have been a guest

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on his show.
He came out to Illinois here at

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Mount Olive and he did an
assembly at the high school with

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our students.
And Sam is just a great person.

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So plug for Sam Demma and, and
his podcast, if you haven't

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listened to it, I highly
recommend it.

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He's a great person, a great
speaker, and you know, I, I call

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him a friend, so highly
recommend him.

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But I, I digress.
Getting back on top, Harman,

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when when you were talking to
him, you were talking about the

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fact there are so many things
that our kids can do and we can

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help them to, you know,
establish some life skills.

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So if you start your day with
those 10 breaths, the teacher

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doesn't have to lead them.
If if you train a student to

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lead that activity, then the
teacher can model what a learner

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looks like.
So it's kind of a win, win and.

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I love, I love what you're doing
right now because you're pausing

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and you're.
Reflecting.

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And you're giving yourself
permission to recall something

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rather than all of this
pressure.

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It's like recall, recall,
recall.

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It's just like, oh, can we sit
and just be for a moment or two

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or 4 and allow the wisdom that
we have within us to come forth

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as opposed to us being on
demand.

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And one of the things, and I
think Sam and I talked about

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this is, and you and I talked
about this before, is

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unfortunately, our system is
pumping out overwhelmed, anxious

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young people, whether they're 5
or 18 or 19.

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And it breaks my heart that we
are sending these humans out

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into the world that don't have
the skill set to share their

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gift with the world.
Yeah.

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And when they're almost in
height.

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When we have all of this
pressure and we put this

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pressure on ourselves, on our
students, on the staff in our

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schools, and that's what we're
seeing, there's all this

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cortisol that's flooding our
brain.

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And I remember that so well.
You know, in my last season of

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the superintendency, the last
probably two months, it was just

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pressure, pressure, pressure and
constant cortisol flooding my

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brain.
And that's what I really saw, my

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health start to decline.
That's what my doctor said to

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me.
You've got to do something

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different.
This is not good for you and

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you're not going to get better
as long as you stay in an

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environment where you cannot
heal, where you cannot recover

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from the pressure.
And that requires sometimes for

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us to step away, but not always.
And I think if if you employ the

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strategies that you teach to
teachers and that I teach to

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leaders proactively and get
really clear on the vision and

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do some backward mapping on
creating the habits and the

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mindset, connecting with that
purpose piece to get the life

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you want, you are going to be
much more successful in living a

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healthy life where you're
prioritizing your mental health

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and your Wellness.
And it's it's I was just looking

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at your HOPE acronym here on a
piece of paper beside me.

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And like you talked about when
you were going to your doctor,

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when your doctor, that
excellence that you wanted to

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provide as a Superintendent was
starting to wane.

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And as teachers, when we hit
that point, like I know when I

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hit that point, I didn't know
that I'd hit that point.

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And the people that were around
me were telling me that I'm

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like, like, I'm like, I'm
strong.

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I can do this.
These kids need me.

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And so it's like, can we go back
to that purpose?

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And that passion is if we are
don't have that passion about

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our purpose, it's really
powerful to step away.

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And I don't know about the
culture in the United States,

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but sometimes the culture in
Canada is that when you step

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away and take a leap of absence,
there's stigma around it, I

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guess, and that you're not
strong.

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And for me, I beg to differ.
I'm like, if you have the

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courage to step away to take
care of yourself, that makes you

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even stronger because you are
prioritizing yourself.

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And teachers often don't it
again, it breaks my heart.

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So some of the teachers that are
in my workshops and when I do

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conventions and, and different
speaking things is they are so

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exhausted.
But like me, they are so

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invested that they can't step
away.

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And the other thing that happens
is we have another life, right?

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I have two kids, I have a
husband, I live on a ranch.

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So there are lots of other
things that need to be done and

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there's and there's a need for
energy and capacity outside the

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classroom.
And that for me, when I left

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teaching, I had none.
And I made a decision that I

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wanted to spend more time with
my own children instead of

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giving it away to other people's
children.

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Not that I didn't love other
people's children, but I'm like,

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I want my kids to get the best
part of me.

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Absolutely.
And you know, the, the sobering

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00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:03,240
fact about this conversation
that we are having here today is

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that no matter who you are or
where you serve or even what you

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do, whether you're a teacher or
a leader or a paraprofessional,

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it doesn't matter what you do.
When I left the superintendency

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and prioritized my own health,
within the space of about a

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month, they had a replacement.
They replaced me.

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They moved on.
As important as you are, and I

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want the listeners to hear this,
you are important and I value

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you and I care about you.
We have to prioritize and we

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have to normalize that.
And our world is so fast-paced.

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And it has come back to my mind,
the aha moment that I had when

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you were speaking earlier about
students reflecting and writing

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down, you know, just a
reflection of their morning.

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We kind of still focus on that
medical model where we look at

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what's wrong, we look at what's
wrong.

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What if we shifted that and we
focused on a strength based

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perspective.
Reflect, but reflect on what is

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right because when you whatever
you focus on is what grows.

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So if I focus on what's wrong,
I'm amplifying that.

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If I focus on what's right, I'm
also amplifying that.

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So make a choice and choose
wisely to focus on the strengths

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rather than the deficits.
Yeah, I love that reminder of

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that focusing on on the
strengths and that gratitude

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piece that could come in about
what we do focus on, expand.

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00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:45,520
So why would we focus on the -1
of the things I also wanted to

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00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:48,000
circle back about the student
leadership was when you talked

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00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:49,760
about the kids leading the 10
breaths.

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00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:55,960
That is such a powerful model
because in leadership, we want

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to, we want to support kids in
leadership.

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And we, you know, we know, we
all know we've got kids that

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walk into classrooms, into
buildings that have got

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leadership down and it's like in
their blood.

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And then there's kids that
struggle with it.

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And then there's kids that just
like have had no opportunity to

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lead.
And what I love about moments of

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having kids lead the 10 breaths
or having kids lead a game or.

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Kids love, well, most kids, I
shouldn't say all kids, most

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kids love to be up in front of a
classroom and teaching and

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leading something and sharing
something that is a gift or

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something that they love to do.
So can we begin to foster those

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leadership skills, especially in
the kids who have never been

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taught or don't even understand
that they there are these skills

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and that they can acquire them
and they can practice them in a

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safe place in a classroom.
And what the tenfold piece for

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this is, that means that
teachers aren't leading

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everything all the time.
It's like, can you model it a

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couple times?
Then can you invite kids to do

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it?
And can you learn from, you

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00:20:58,040 --> 00:20:59,800
know, the kids that are
struggling and have those

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conversations and the support
and that collaboration and

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teamwork so that everybody can
feel successful?

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And there's this Co creation
that goes on in the classrooms.

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I love Co creating kids with
kids.

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When I was in my classrooms, in
fact, some of the favorite

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projects and lessons I taught, I
was like, OK, this is what we

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need to do.
What do we want to do?

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And we plan out the whole
project together.

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And then the kids were totally
invested in it because all of

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their ideas were interwoven into
it.

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And I didn't have to like, it's
back to that don't have to do it

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00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:36,360
by yourself piece, that
collaboration piece.

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Let's get 2535 bodies out
collaborating.

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And there's so much more
engagement and fun.

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And I'm not pulling them along.
They're showing me new cool

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things.
Yeah, and you're fostering

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ownership and they're learning,
you know, and I think leaders

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that are listening to this today
too can learn from that model as

356
00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:00,120
well because there's a lot of
initiatives and there's a lot of

357
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:04,120
things that need to get done in
a school or a district.

358
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And when you do that with your
staff and you give them voice

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and you give them choice, you're
fostering ownership in every

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initiative that you're leading.
As a Superintendent, I Co

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created a strategic plan with
our board and then our

362
00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:28,880
leadership team created the the
goals and objectives that went

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00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:34,240
along with that.
And keeping that vision, not

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00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,800
only collaborating, but then
keeping it in front of the

365
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,240
people and driving that vision
forward.

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It's powerful.
It's powerful to create that

367
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:46,440
change that we seek in our
schools and in our districts,

368
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:49,920
and I love.
What you say about that, it's

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00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:53,000
front and center, right?
When we talk about pause and

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00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,680
reflect, we don't do it once and
then it's like, OK, we've done

371
00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:58,400
the pause and reflect.
We've checked it off.

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It's like, how can we we revisit
it and it becomes a habit.

373
00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,720
Excuse me.
And that's one of the things

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00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:09,040
like for me, I have a coaching
group of educators and there's

375
00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:11,760
some non educators in it.
And we meet on a weekly basis.

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00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:15,560
And that touch point, sometimes
it's half an hour, sometimes

377
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:19,160
it's an hour, reminds people of
like the direction they're

378
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:23,080
facing, what they're working on
so that they can aim in that

379
00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,400
direction as opposed to walk out
in the world and get lost

380
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:29,120
because there's so much going on
in our world, There's so much

381
00:23:29,120 --> 00:23:30,400
chaos.
We're organizing.

382
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:35,080
And when we can go.
Oh, yeah, I'm facing the right

383
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,400
direction today.
And there are days when we're

384
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:38,680
not.
There are days when we're just

385
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:41,320
like what happened in my day.
I I have not been facing the

386
00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,960
right direction.
And those touch points with the

387
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:47,840
kids in your classroom,
sometimes the colleagues down in

388
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:50,800
the hallway remind you of where
you're going and what you're up

389
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,560
to.
And then the other stuff that

390
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:57,920
distracts us can fall away and
we can head in the direction

391
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,600
that we're choosing.
And I know in your work, you do

392
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:03,600
stuff on values and I love like
I love values.

393
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:06,480
I use Drew Dudley's values all
the time in the work that I do

394
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:12,000
because it's like, oh, how can I
align my choices today with my

395
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,800
core values?
And then I feel like I'm showing

396
00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:19,800
up authentically me and in, in
teaching values in classrooms.

397
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:21,560
And you and I talked about this
a bit as well.

398
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,680
It gives students the vocabulary
for something that's a little

399
00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:28,920
bit intangible when it comes to
speaking about values, where

400
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:30,680
they're like, oh, these are
examples.

401
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:34,640
This is what values look like
and can sound like and how I can

402
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:39,160
act on my values.
So it's so powerful to give the

403
00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:43,040
language to people.
And you do that in your program,

404
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,640
and I do that in my program.
And then those touch points,

405
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:47,840
it's like, how do we touch
points?

406
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,840
Or how do we touch base with
people and go, OK, how are you

407
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:55,280
doing and not on a meet your
neighbor in the grocery store,

408
00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:56,960
how are you doing?
Yeah, I'm fine.

409
00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:00,000
Kind of conversation, but a
deeper conversation of what's

410
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,600
really going on under the
surface that we don't always

411
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:04,560
talk about.
And sometimes we're not safe to

412
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:08,200
talk about in our workplaces.
But finding those places as a

413
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:14,040
leader where you can talk about
the stuff that's real like I

414
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:15,480
used to.
You were talking earlier and it

415
00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:19,120
made me think when I drove to
school the last probably year

416
00:25:19,120 --> 00:25:22,720
that I worked in my classroom,
my arms ached from my shoulders

417
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:26,480
down about four minutes after I
left my house.

418
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:28,360
They would ache for about 5
minutes and then it would be

419
00:25:28,360 --> 00:25:30,640
done.
And it was the stress and

420
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,000
anxiety in my body.
And it's just like, those are

421
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,080
the things that we don't always
talk about that we need to

422
00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:40,080
unpack with a friend, a
colleague, or even a paid

423
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,640
professional because it's not
going to go away.

424
00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:46,560
It's going to head head people
in the direction that you and I

425
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,000
have both been in, where it's
just like we had to walk away.

426
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:55,800
Yeah, and and that, you know,
long term that stress, you can

427
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:59,040
go back to Doctor Nadine Burke
Harris's work and she wrote the

428
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:00,640
book The Deepest.
Well, I don't know if you've

429
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:04,800
read that before, but it talks
about, she talks about the Aces

430
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:10,880
study and, and how trauma
manifests in the body when it is

431
00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:13,840
unresolved.
But you can work through that

432
00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:17,880
and you can heal from that.
And there are very simple

433
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:21,000
strategies that you can
implement into your daily life

434
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:23,840
to heal from that and to move
forward.

435
00:26:24,120 --> 00:26:26,600
And for those people that are
investing, they're like, oh, I

436
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:28,720
would never walk away no matter
what.

437
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:34,800
Well, start today, then start
today and start investing in

438
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:40,880
yourself so that you have
longevity in the purpose and the

439
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:45,360
passion that you call your your
job.

440
00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:47,360
Your role.
Whatever that may be.

441
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:52,640
So with that, I know you've been
doing this work for some time

442
00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:57,120
Carmen, and I'm curious, do you
have a story of why hope is

443
00:26:57,120 --> 00:27:00,360
important?
A story maybe of some hope

444
00:27:00,360 --> 00:27:01,720
fueled leadership?
I.

445
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,120
Actually want to share a story
with student leaders?

446
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:08,280
Actually perfectly about 5 or 6
years ago, 'cause I volunteered

447
00:27:08,280 --> 00:27:10,200
with student leadership across
Canada and various different

448
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:13,160
things, and I was in Ontario and
got to hang out with 500 student

449
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,000
leaders from across Canada.
It's so amazing.

450
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,200
But I was volunteering here
locally and I did some

451
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:23,120
meditation with kids with like
16 to 18 year old kids, probably

452
00:27:23,120 --> 00:27:25,040
a room full of about 25 or 30 of
them.

453
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:28,160
And we're just doing this pause.
And they're just sitting

454
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:31,480
quietly.
And me up at the front as

455
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:34,840
teachers have done, sorry, as
teachers will have done in the

456
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:39,360
past, is you're up there and
you're wondering if what you're

457
00:27:39,360 --> 00:27:42,800
doing matters, right?
Is, is this helpful?

458
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:45,200
Are they thinking this is dumb?
Like these are the thoughts that

459
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:48,320
are going through my mind.
And so I just, I sit with it.

460
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,400
I sit with my uncomfortableness.
And after this 2 minutes of

461
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:58,360
silence, the kids shared their
experience and I had one young

462
00:27:58,360 --> 00:28:04,000
person go like they were in
tears because no one has ever

463
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:07,600
given the permit them permission
to just pause.

464
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:15,360
It blew my mind.
And that person actually left

465
00:28:15,360 --> 00:28:17,560
the leadership program because
they had too many things on

466
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:20,600
their plate and too many great
things on their plate.

467
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:22,440
And I think that happens.
Because.

468
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:25,760
Sometimes we have too many great
things on our plate and we're

469
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:29,000
like, oh, I have too many things
on my plate, so I can't lean

470
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,480
into something else.
And that's one of the things

471
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:36,360
that I find when I work with
teachers in my program is

472
00:28:36,360 --> 00:28:38,960
they're like, oh, this is the
best thing that's happened to me

473
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:42,120
and that I've made space because
what I do with you doesn't

474
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,000
actually take extra time.
It takes what I'm already doing

475
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,840
and refining it so that I can
actually show up.

476
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:53,120
Enjoy with hope about what I do
in my classrooms or in my life

477
00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:59,120
so that I am excited and show up
with that excited energy instead

478
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,360
of dragging themselves into
their classrooms.

479
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:04,720
Absolutely.
That's a powerful story and a

480
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:10,560
wonderful reminder for our
listeners that we need to model

481
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:16,120
pausing for our kids.
We need to again normalize the

482
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:21,160
fact that we're human beings and
there are some life skills that

483
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:26,480
we as educators can teach our
kids and help them to reach

484
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:28,880
their fullest potential.
So that's a powerful.

485
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:33,520
Story and I want to share one
other quick story too.

486
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:35,720
Leadership students.
Again, I was in St.

487
00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,240
John, NB, with leadership kids
and I did the 10 breaths we

488
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:40,960
talked about earlier in this
podcast.

489
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:45,960
And later next day, a young
lady's like, oh, Carmen, thank

490
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:47,760
you for teaching me those.
I'm like, oh, you're welcome.

491
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:49,880
She's like, no, no, no, no, you
don't understand.

492
00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,240
Like, OK, tell me more 'cause I
want to know.

493
00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:56,760
And she's like those 10 breaths
had saved her two panic attacks

494
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,520
in the last 24 hours.
Wow, yeah.

495
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:06,080
I was like blown away.
And so if if we can take a total

496
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:10,520
of 10 minutes out of our day and
save kids panic attacks, sign me

497
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:14,160
up.
Oh, 100 percent, 100%.

498
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:16,200
And you don't know what people
are carrying.

499
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,760
You know, the kids in our
schools, the teachers in our

500
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:21,880
schools, the leaders in our
schools.

501
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:24,960
We're dealing with people and
the people.

502
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:29,760
Business can be messy.
There's a lot of baggage in our

503
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:33,920
schools and our districts.
And these very simple, practical

504
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:40,520
tools can really help people.
I wish many, many years ago that

505
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:42,480
I had learned the things that I
know now.

506
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:46,400
You know, how powerful would it
be as a student in high school

507
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:49,960
or even junior high or
elementary school to learn some

508
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,760
of these strategies?
I was well into adulthood before

509
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:59,640
I learned some of these things.
And we as educators have the

510
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:03,960
power to teach our kids these
strategies, to teach each other

511
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,320
these strategies and to model
them.

512
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:12,240
And that gives me hope.
So what gives you hope today as

513
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,160
we're talking?
I love that question because the

514
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:18,080
young people that I get to
interact give me hope.

515
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:21,120
Like that's one thing, One big
thing that gives me hope and the

516
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,840
other thing that gives me hope.
And you reminded me earlier when

517
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:26,720
you were talking about healing
and trauma is healing is this

518
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:30,360
idea that we can the things that
are wonky in our bodies that

519
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:33,920
aren't working and in our minds
and like our whole being and in

520
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,480
our environments.
And so that's another thing that

521
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:40,680
gives me hope is I get to decide
who I want to be and how I want

522
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:44,040
to show up in this world and the
impact and the ripple effect I

523
00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,040
have.
And the more that I can give

524
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:50,280
myself grace and space to heal
my own traumas, the more I'm

525
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:54,160
able to offer what I meant to be
here for to the world just like

526
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:55,880
you do.
It's just like, how can we step

527
00:31:55,880 --> 00:32:00,120
out of the burnout, step into
alignment with our values, and

528
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:04,280
lead from that place in what
we're truly meant to do in this

529
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:09,240
world?
I love it so much and I think

530
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,600
that there are going to be
people that are listening to

531
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:15,360
this podcast today that want to
get into contact with you,

532
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:17,920
Carmen.
So how would the listeners get

533
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,280
in touch?
With you, you could get in touch

534
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:26,080
with me via e-mail.
So it's Carmen CARMANI joke.

535
00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:31,960
It's one car and one man at at
healthyteachers.ca.

536
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:37,480
My website is
www.healthyteachers.ca and you

537
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:40,000
can also check out the book that
I wrote for teachers on burnout.

538
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:44,000
You can see the if you're on
video, you can see the Teachers

539
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,360
First poster behind me, Teachers
First, a guide to avoiding an

540
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,120
overcoming burnout in the
classroom.

541
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:54,400
Just to support you and help you
along in your journey.

542
00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:57,240
Yeah, and I'd love to hear from
you.

543
00:32:57,240 --> 00:32:59,160
I'm also on Instagram and
LinkedIn.

544
00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:03,960
I love the image too.
It's an image of an apple on

545
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:06,960
fire.
Love it, love it.

546
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:10,480
Carmen And Carmen, I am grateful
that you join me today on the

547
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,720
Lead With Hope podcast.
So, as always, keep leading with

548
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,480
hope.
Thanks so much, Brandy.

549
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:26,080
Thank you so much for tuning
into today's episode of Lead

550
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,840
with Hope, where we believe that
leadership rooted in habits,

551
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:34,560
optimistic mindset, purpose, and
excellence can truly change the

552
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,320
world.
I'd love to ask you for a small

553
00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:40,960
favor that makes a big impact.
Help me spread hope.

554
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,760
Share this episode with a friend
or a colleague who could use a

555
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:48,120
little encouragement today.
And if this conversation

556
00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:51,920
inspired you, please take a
moment to head over and give the

557
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:55,600
show a five star rating.
It helps others find us and

558
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:57,800
keeps the message of hope
growing strong.

559
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:02,760
I'm also excited to share
something new with you, the Hope

560
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:06,360
Fueled Kickstart.
This is a powerful short term,

561
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:10,560
one-on-one coaching experience
designed to help leaders like

562
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:15,480
you reclaim your vision, reset
your mindset, and reignite your

563
00:34:15,480 --> 00:34:17,920
purpose so you can lead with
hope again.

564
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,560
To learn more about the
Kickstart program, just click

565
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:25,840
the link in the show notes.
Until next time, remember the

566
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:28,480
world needs your leadership and
change starts with you.

567
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:33,280
Fuel your life with hope,
embrace your purpose, and shine

568
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:34,560
your light for others.