Exploring the Future of Technology in Education with John Sowash

WEBVTT

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Good pedagogy. Good teaching is relatively
timeless. I just try to focus my

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time and energy on helping teachers do
the things we already know that work.

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They're not always the sexiest, but
you gotta do the good, quality work.

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Welcome to the Leader of Learning podcast. I'm your host, doctor Dan

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Krinis, and this is where I
help educators grow their impact as instructional leaders

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because my research and leadership experiences have
led me to understand that someone like you,

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regardless of your role or your title, can have a tremendous impact on

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your organization. I chat with inspiring
guests who are truly making an impact as

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instructional leaders. Whether this is your
first time listening or you come back for

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more, I hope you've subscribed to
this show on your preferred podcast app so

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you don't miss any of the great
episodes, topics, or guests. Anyway,

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I'm so glad you've tuned in.
Now let's get started. Hey,

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they're Leader of Learning. Welcome into
episode one sixty five of the Leader of

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Learning podcast. I know it's been
a little while since we last published an

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episode, but I did just want
to remind you that in order to keep

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in touch and keep up to date
with everything that's going on with me and

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with Leader of Learning. You can
always subscribe to my email newsletter by heading

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to Dancrinis dot com slash news.
You'll be able to keep up with the

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latest happenings with Leader of Learning as
well as be on the inside track to

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some really great resources that are shared
here. Anyway, again, in order

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to subscribe, head to Dancrinis dot
com slash news. This episode is going

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to feature a really great guest and
someone who I've gotten to know quite a

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bit over the past several years.
John Sowash is a leading expert in the

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areas of Google for education as well
as using Chromebooks for education. His brand,

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The Chromebook Classroom and his podcast of
the same name are really inspirational to

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myself who works in a school in
a district that uses almost exclusively Chromebooks,

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but to many educators and educational leaders
when it comes to educational technology in general,

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but more specifically using Chromebooks and really
tapping into the vast array of products,

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services, and resources that are coming
out all the time and being updated

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all the time by Google. I
was recently able to attend the FETC Conference

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in Orlando, Florida. If you've
never been there. FETC stands for Future

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of Education Technology Conference. It was
an amazing time. I learned so much.

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I left very much inspired to continue
the work to try and innovate in

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education, especially through the use of
technology and preparing our teachers, but especially

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our students to be more future ready. And that was where I got a

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chance to connect with John finally in
person after speaking just virtually for many years

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now, and to record this interview
with John. So without further ado,

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we will get right to it after
these messages. Is my interview with John

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Sowash. All right, welcome back, Leader of Learning. I'm here at

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the FETC conference in Orlando, Florida
with good friend, although we just met

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in person for the first time,
John Sowash. John is an expert in

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all things chromebooks and Google and Google
apps and Google what do we call it

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now, Google work, Google Workspace, Education rolls right off exactly, So

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John, welcome. It's been a
pleasure meeting you in person. And I

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guess for the audience who may not
know you yet, if you could just

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introduce yourself, who you are,
where you are, and what you do.

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Yeah, my name is John Slash, and I help teachers and students

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use Google products in the classroom.
That's the most discinct way to put it.

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I do courses, written a book, webinars, person pd conferences,

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blogging, podcasting, everything related to
Google. I know a lot about a

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very small part of the Internet.
So we're at the Future of Education Technology

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Conference, and I think I'd be
remiss if I didn't first ask you first

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and foremost, where are we going
in the near future with technology and education?

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And then of course, specific to
kind of your expertise as it relates

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to Google and chromebooks, what's next, like what's on the horizon, and

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then maybe even beyond the horizon,
what's really in the future. Well,

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I mean, it doesn't take a
rock scientist to notice that AI is,

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you know, just taking over everything. I don't know that you could attend

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a single session here at fetc.
Without hearing AI mentioned in some fashion.

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Google is certainly on that bandwagon as
well. And A that's cool. I'm

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going to keep my eye on it, using it, trying to figure out

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where it fits into the classroom.
But I mean, to be completely honest

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with you, you know, it's
always great to check out the newest,

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the latest and greatest things, but
ultimately, good pedagogy, good teaching is

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relatively timeless. You could always add
in a little bit of AI to good

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teaching, but I just try to
focus my time and energy on helping teachers

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do the things we already know that
work. They're not always the sexiest,

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but you gotta do the good,
quality work, and that I mean that

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takes up more than more time than
anybody has to check out. So I

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try not to chase all the shiny
things and focus on, you know,

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things that are tried and true.
But like I said, AI is absolutely

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going to impact every aspect of life, not just education. One of the

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things that I appreciate when I listen
to your podcast and consume your content is

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that you tend to kind of hit
all angles when it comes to teach.

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You with chromebooks and using Google tools. You talk about it from how to

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use it with and how it impacts
students, obviously teachers in the classroom,

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but even leaders, whether they be
building leaders or IT leaders and technology leaders

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in the district. So I'm wondering
when it comes to AI, or just

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in general, some of these new
trending technologies like what does it look like

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at each of those levels, considering
how are we using these tools with students?

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What should teachers be doing right now
to prepare themselves for the next challenges,

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let's say, the next risks that
they should be taking in the classroom

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instructionally, and then how do our
leaders support all that? Absolutely now,

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Dan, the first thing I'm going
to say is that anybody who ever comes

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on your show and tells you how
AI is going to impact everything and what

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everybody should do about it is lying
because nobody has a clue. Everybody is

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just guessing. We really don't know
and do not understand how we are going

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to effectively implement AI at the student
level. There are so many privacy issues,

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There's just a lot of technical issues
that have to be worked out.

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I don't have a great sense of
that. I mean, every AI tool

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that I'm seeing so far is,
you know, thirteen plus is the best

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I've seen eighteen. I mean Google's
tools are mostly eighteen plus right now.

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Nobody's really pushing AI at the student
level. So what I would say in

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terms of leadership is you cannot have
an opinion about AI if you have not

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used it. You have got to
get in there and you've got to play

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around with it. Form your own
opinion. Maybe you think it's the worst

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thing ever, that's fine, but
you've got to actually use it. You've

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got to use chat, GPT,
you got to use Google Bard, you've

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got to use Adobe's products, Microsoft's
you know, co pilot, use them

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all. Form your own opinion.
Read what others are saying, which you

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have to use it yourself. Every
use case is so unique. That's why

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AI so fascinating, is I mean, I've talked to Principles, math teachers,

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English teachers, kindergarten teachers, school
nurses, psychologists. Everybody has a

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unique and interesting way to use AI. So I can't possibly tell everybody how

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it's gonna work. You just got
to try it out. Same thing with

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Principles. Leaders need to give the
freedom in the space for their teachers to

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try it. I do have a
pretty hard time when schools are you know,

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blocking it, restricting it can't use
it. I don't think that's widespread.

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It certainly makes the news when it
happens, but giving you your staff

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time and space to explore I think
is important. This podcast is a proud

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member of the Teach Better Podcast Network, Better Today, Better Tomorrow, and

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the podcast to get you there.
Explore more podcasts at www dot Teach Better

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Podcastnetwork dot com. Now let's get
back to the episode. What about teachers,

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especially or leaders themselves, who might
say, oh, that's easier said

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than done, that I don't know
how to get in there and start playing

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with the tools and learning the tools, or I don't have time or I

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don't have the time to give over
to teachers to do it. Do you

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have any suggestions for just where to
start? Yeah, I mean, I

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really don't think there's any excuse for
anybody saying I just don't know how to

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get started. I mean, YouTube
is an amazing thing. There are so

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many resources, free resources to learn
about anything you want, so there's ample

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opportunity, no cost, easy to
get started. Time is always a factor.

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The reality is we make time for
the things we feel are important.

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So yeah, something might have to
get cut, but that's that's always true.

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The value proposition for AI and I
have personally found this is you do

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save time. Like, depending on
what you're doing, you are saving time,

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and so you may have to invest
a little bit to get started,

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but long term, I think you'll
come out ahead. I mean it is

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cool. That is, it's still
such an exciting time in education and exploring

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new tools, new trends, new
topics. This may be a timely conversation

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too that we're having. It sounds
like seems like there were some announcements that

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you are part of, not part
of, but att of kind of breaking

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that Google just the oh yeah,
Google School is always announcing something that we're

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at fetc. Everybody else is at
the BET conference that's the British Educational Technology

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Conference really bad, like is the
size over in London and Google's there.

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They made a bunch of announcements today. You've got some typical kind of just

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regular updates to Chromebooks and Google Classroom, just a little new features. They

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did talk about duet ai for Google
Workspace. They announced it today. The

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reality is has been out for months, but they've never really promoted it for

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education districts. It's they've been promoting
it for business. So they've kind of

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announced it like schools can sign up
for it as well. I've been using

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it for two three months. It's
fine. Hasn't blown me away, and

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you know, the the challenge and
this is not really Google's problem it's going

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to be a challenge for everybody.
Is the cost. So duet AI for

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Google Workspace is thirty dollars per user
per month. That's a hefty press.

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It's a lot of money. Now
it doesn't matter any AI tool. We

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are quickly exiting the initial phase of
AI, which is help us figure out

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how to do this, and we're
getting into paid phase. I mean,

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you look at Magic, School,
brisk any of the popular they're all charging

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now. AI is so computationally expensive
it costs them a ton of money.

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So there's just no way around that. I just saw Sam Altman, the

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CEO of chat GPT or open Ai, said that really for AI to take

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the next step forward, there has
to be a huge breakthrough in energy,

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Like they have to figure out how
to make processors run faster on less energy

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to lower the cost overall. I
just saw I don't know if you saw

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this headline. Microsoft just hired a
bunch of nuclear physicists because they're working on

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some crazy like energy thing, who
knows. But we have the AI technology.

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We just have to lessen the price
and not help everybody. Wow.

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So it's exciting, but it's also
getting expensive. Did I see that?

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There were some Google Classrooms. Oh
yeah, got some updates. I mean

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the one that I think teachers will
be most excited about is custom persistent groups

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project groups. So Google Classroom has
always had a huge problem where you can

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easily sign stuff to everybody, but
if you want to create a group and

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then use that group, you know, for an entire quarter or something,

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it just was no great way to
do that. So that'll be a really

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nice update. I don't have a
date on that, just coming soon.

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I remember when they first launched the
feature to where you can assign a certain

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students, and I thought that in
and of itself was kind of a game

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changer. That's halfway there. Yeah, like when it comes to differentiation for

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students, being able to assign different
things to different kids like they would be

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in groups. But it was a
little wonky and I hate using that word,

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but that's the best. It's an
app description. Yeah, uh,

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you know again the challenge. You
know, that feature and all of the

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other Google Classroom related features that were
announced today are all tied to Google workspaceed

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for Education plus that's their premium edition, and a lot of schools have you

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know, become a little frustrated by
that. The reality is even as big

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as Google is, they do not
have unlimited resources, especially in education.

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I mean, all their money is
made by search. The education team does

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not make any money, and so
they have to recoup that somehow, and

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so most of the education specific features
moving forward are going to require a premium

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premium account. Yeah, that makes
sense. As we wrap up, I

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caught some of your session yesterday afternoon
on all this stuff, chromebooks especially,

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and I always get a kick out
of when you say that you do everything

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on a chromebook and you moved away
from MacBook. But I guess specifically,

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you know, my entire district,
and I'm in a pretty large district minus

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the kindergarten students are all on Chromebooks, and starting next school year, our

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entire six through twelve, all the
middle schools and high schools will be part

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of the Verizon Innovative Learning School Program, which helps provide Chromebooks to districts and

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students for consistent access and equity.
So I'm kind of curious on a personal

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level too, like where are we
going with chromebooks, because I know that

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one of the things you share was
how far they have come and how they

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keep upgrading and updating and just getting
better and better, not just for students

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but for everyone. So I kind
of wanted to give you the floor and

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ask you about chromebooks specifically. Yeah, so two things have happened. Certainly,

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chromos has matured as a platform.
It's not just a web browser anymore.

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So that has happened, and that
will continue to happen. You know,

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I don't really think there's any glaring
missing pieces for Chromo ass They'll just

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keep making a little bit better every
time. But really, the thing that

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has changed when I started using chromebook
full time, there were some rough spots.

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The most difficult thing for me to
figure out how to do in Chromebork

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was podcasting, recording and editing audio. There just weren't a lot of great

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tools. The second thing that's really
improved is just the web has matured.

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I mean, there are very few
things you cannot do in a browser today,

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seven, eight, ten years ago. That was not always the case.

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You know, I was teaching during
the app craze of you know,

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the iPad launch of what twenty nine, ten eleven, where everything had to

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have an app. I feel that
that's worn off and people are like,

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you know, what. The Web's
great. I don't have to update it.

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It just works when I go there. Everything's in the cloud. Internet

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connections have gotten a lot more stable, faster, and so it's just an

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expectation. So yeah, today,
I mean, there's really nothing you can't

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do in the browser. There are
certainly some things that I would, you

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know, love to see improved.
I mean, even the Adobe Creative Suite,

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they're not there yet, but they're
moving in a web direction, having

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web versions of Photoshop, for example. It's kind of they're not quite but

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you know five years ago that wasn't
even you couldn't even contemplate that. So

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yeah, it's good, Dan.
What's it going to take to get you

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to switch to Team Chrome? You
know, it's funny because I was thinking,

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as you were talking about some tools
that I like to use that aren't

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web based, but I could probably
find substitutes that are. And I'll give

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you example. When I edit for
video and for YouTube, I like using

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tools like Cantasia and Da Vinci Resolve. Da Vinci Resolve is I mean that's

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like a full feature professional platform.
However, one that is really trending and

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up and coming, and you know, it's a it's kind of a tiktoky

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thing is cap cut and they have
an amazing web version of their platform,

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and I've dabbled in it a little
bit. I don't use it a lot,

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but yeah, like you said,
there's there are a lot of opportunities

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for doing what you need to do
on the web. At one point I

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got around using Audacity on a chromebook
by installing Linux and the Linux version.

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But yeah, so I think da
Vinci has a Linux version too. That

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could be I haven't explored that,
but yeah I could. I could probably

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switch to being ach chrobook guy.
You can do everything you need to do

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on the web. It definitely would
potentially require a workflow change. Now,

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since this this is the Leader of
Learning podcast, you know your district is

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all in on chromebooks. The biggest
mistake that I see schools making with chromebook

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deployments is teachers and leadership not using
chromebooks. Now, I'm not you don't

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have to use a chromebook full time, but there is there are differences between

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chromebooks, Mac and PC, and
so if you want to set an example

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as a leader, it would mean
so much if the principal walked into the

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next staff meeting using a Chromebook.
You need to set the example if you

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expect your students to use it,
and you can fully believe that platform is

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one that's good for learning, it
should be good enough for you. It's

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gonna take a little work, not
easy, but it can be done.

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No, I agree with that one
hundred percent. As you were talking,

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though, I feel kind of proud
that I don't know about all the leaders,

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but the teachers prefer a lot of
times to use the Verizon issued chromebooks

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we have for a couple of reasons. One they're touchscreen. Two, we

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have Verizon data plans on each of
the devices, So essentially they operate like

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a cell phone where if you're not
on Wi Fi, you're somewhere where there's

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not Internet, but there's data,
there's Verizon cell service, you can still

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use your Chromebook. But also,
and probably most importantly, we've found ways

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we have across the district ViewSonic screens
as opposed to like smartboards or Prometheans.

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We have ViewSonic and view Sonic has
an app called Vcast and you can send

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or cast your Chromebook screen. So
it used to be a couple of years

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ago when we first got these oh, I'm sorry. There's really there's no

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HDMI oh on the device, so
I'm sorry you can't share your screen on

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the view Sonic. But now we
can cast wirelessly and it works amazingly.

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The teacher can actually carry the device
around the classroom if they need to.

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It's touch screen. It's really great. And to your point too, I

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still see them even not in the
classroom but carrying them to staff meetings and

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professional development. So it is pretty
cool. As we go, I would

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be remiss if I didn't ask also
for you to tell us where we can

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find you and access your content and
your Chromebook Classroom brand and everything that you're

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00:21:38.240 --> 00:21:42.640
doing. Yeah, if you just
search for my name or Chromebook classroom should

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00:21:42.680 --> 00:21:48.359
pull up pretty easily, have the
Chromo Classroom blog, podcast, YouTube channel,

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and yeah, chat about all things
Chroma can web based things, so

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anything that's web based we would jump
in talk about, like we've been chat

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about AI is hot right now,
so we've been talking a lot about that

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and whatever the latest updates are.
I try to break it down and tell

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you what's important. All right,
Well, it's been great meeting up in

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00:22:08.559 --> 00:22:11.559
person. Thanks for your time,
Dan, You've been an Internet friend for

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00:22:11.599 --> 00:22:15.480
a long time. A right,
and it's great to meet you in person.

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00:22:15.519 --> 00:22:18.680
That's why conferences like this are so
awesome, so much better than the

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00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:22.799
virtual ones, because you get to
chat with people in the whole way,

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see people from all of the country. Definitely, all right, my friend,

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Thanks, thanks for your time.
Well that's it for this episode.

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00:22:33.799 --> 00:22:37.599
Thank you so much for listening.
If you haven't done so yet, don't

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do for me is to please let
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